Why Netherlands?

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Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:25 am

Has anyone looked up why the lotto scammers seem to prefer Netherlands as their staging country? I know one reason must be because very few marks would belive they won anything from "Lotto Nigeria", but any other ideas are welcome.

Maybe it's because just about anything is legal there, or because of that weird "save your money" guy on the commercials...

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:28 am

Hmm, I don't notice it comes from the Netherlands that much, mine come from mostly Australia , US, UK, and Nigeria. Then they say it was "Internationally won".

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:33 am

Its probably because lotto scams need more sophisticated forms and backup to pull off successfully.
European lads are better financed and have access the services required and the returns are quite high . There is a fairly large Nigerian community there too. Canada is another hotspot for lotto scams.

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:49 am

Yeah, you'll find that Amsterdam has a big scamming community. Some (but obviously not all) are expat Nigerian with some past 419 experience.

As windy says, the lotto lads have to be a bit more tech savvy, and the European based guys fit the bill in that respect. They have access to better templates, and more advanced help from their network of accomplices.

Baiting Guru Joined: 17 Sep 2006 Posts: 5905

I find most of the lotto lads these days operate from the UK or sometimes Nigerians pretending they are in the UK. It seems that trends change over time and scammers move on a lot. Another example, it is traditional to think most NOK scammers are in Nigeria but the vast majority I come into contact with nowadays are in Burkina Faso.

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:18 pm

What windipops said is right, there is a huge West African criminal network in Amsterdam. They are also trying to muscle into the drug traffic and real estate business, and present the first real challenge to the larely autochtonal criminal community there. They are growing pretty fast.

Many lotteries that claim to be in the Netherlands originate from Nigeria. It might be that the community in Amsterdam works with them, or supplies the with information or something.

Actually, the police in the Netherlands is very effecftive in shutting down their business. Since many are illegal immigrants it's easy to kick them out without a real trial for fraud, which as we know is hard to prove. If a nest of scammers is known to the Amsterdam police they might be subjected to an sudden 'identity control', as well as having their business investigated. Thusly, if you have found a hotspot of scamming activity (i.e. multiple scamming email adresses pointing to a caf� or bar), it might be worthwile to tip the police. Sending anonymous tips to the police is pretty common practise here.

As a Dutchman I don't really like seeing my country 'represented' in such a way, but it's only a question of time. I believe I've seen a trend towards other coutries lately.

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:11 pm

That�s true what Duralex said...the question of time.
Actually seeing that there is an actual lad spot in Hamburg was new and a little shocking for me... (see mathias� thread http://forum.419eater.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=118307)
Because it is no more "only" Lagos, Accra, Johannesburg, but they are networking right into my own neighbourhood. Shocked

But I was glad to hear the Amsterdam police at least is effectively fighting against it

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:11 pm

There is a new fraud team in Amsterdam that is cleaning house. They get their orders directly from the District Attorney, so no use sending them information on your lads.

I believe the reason Amsterdam is so popular is the multi-national atmosphere. You can easily get around the city without speaking a word of Dutch, as long as you speak some English. It is close enough to Germany, Uk, Belgium, France, which is another plus. And hey, can't argue with taste! It is a cool city to live in!

There is also the pull machanism from having other scammers there. Since Amsterdam already has a large community of 419ers, it attracts other lads. They help each other getting into the country and arrange lodging and trave and documentation for them.

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:28 pm

The lotto scammers are (were?) mainly in Spain. 99% of them.

However, there was a mass arrest of them about 18 months ago, I think it was about 300 of them.

Maybe they've moved to Amsterdam now.

From what I've heard, The Netherlands is proceeding in reducing its "tolerancy" policy - on all fronts. I hope the lads won't enjoy their stay there much longer.

Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2007 9:51 am

There was arrest of 115 lads in Amsterdam a few months ago (5 of them connected to one of my baits Very Happy

) so maybe it's a case of "People will hear that and then be more confident that dutch people are trustworthy"?

Do any of those scammers have dutch IPs?

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 2:46 pm

About 60% of the 419 letters I receive come from Amsterdam. Sometimes I receive 4 or 5 a day and other times I receive almost none for a few days. When it slows down I wonder if there has been a big raid.