car scam - out $4000

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Hello I'm New here! Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

Hello all,
here's the story:
my sister-in-law called us a few weeks ago asking how she would pay for a car she found online (on craigslist). I told her that she could pay through paypal, but warned her that she she shouldn't pay for anything until she actually has the car in front of her.

After hanging up, I was concerned that she wasn't going to take my advice so I had my wife call her and try to talk her out of it. She told my wife all kinds of things that threw up serious red flags for me. My wife and i both told her not to get into it and she didn't listen. here's what caused alarm for me:

-the seller was out of state
-the seller claimed to be from our state (WI) but in Utah to care for his sick son
-seller claimed to need money for son's operation
-seller offered to pay shipping of the car to WI
-seller asked for payment through moneygram
-car was WAY too cheap (about $8000 under kelley blue book value)

to you and me, this is obviously a scam in the works, but my sister in law isn't computer savy at all and tends to be too trusting.
the seller assured her that if they complete the money transfer through ebay that she would be assured satisfaction. I didn't understand how ebay would help since the car was listed on craigslist, but...

she got an email from ebay (which was fake) listing the payment, his name and address (most likely also fake) and a third name and address in Canada whom he said would ship the car (more red flags, i know).

Long story short, she sent the money ($4000) against our advice and he disappeared. I had to tell her today that the email from ebay was fake and that she was out the money.

I'm not sure what else to tell her to do though. She doesn't seem to like the idea of calling the local police. I doubt they can help, but I thought it would be good to at least make a report. -i alos thought perhaps they could lead her in another direction to get help.

As far as tracking the IP address, all I have here is the forwarded message and I don't know how to do that. If i view the source I just get my sister-in-law's IP address.

I'm going to copy and paste the forwarded email below. I'll just take out my sister-in-law's info and leave the rest.

Thanks in advance for your help on this one.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

----- Forwarded Message ----
From: eBay <[email protected]>
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 5:47:40 PM
Subject: eBay SafeHarbor Team

eBay sent this message XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
This e-mail message was sent to you from eBay , with the full support of the eBay Payment Security Inc.

Complete your eBay transaction in 5 easy steps:

1. Buyer and seller agree on the transaction terms and a selling price. Seller contacts eBay with the transaction details;

2. eBay accepts the transaction and offers purchase protection to the buyer (if the transaction is declined, no further action is required from either the buyer or the seller);

3. The buyer sends payment to eBay Safe Harbor. After the payment is made , the buyer must notify eBay sending the payment details ONLY to our SafeHarbour Team. The seller has three business days to provide eBay and the buyer with the transport tracking number. If no tracking number is provided, a full refund is immediately sent to the buyer.

4. Buyer receives the merchandise and has 3 (Three) days to inspect it. If it is as expected and as what agreed over, the buyer should accept the merchandise. If he refuses the merchandise by any valid reason, the buyer must ship the merchandise back to the seller at the seller's expense within 3 (Three) business days.

5. Upon the inspection period, buyer must contact eBay with the result of the inspection. If buyer refuses the merchandise, a full refund will be sent to the buyer after the tracking number for the returning shipment is verified.
It is recommended to send the payment as soon as possible, because your purchase protection plan is valid for 3 days only. Sending the payment by any other method of payment will void this transaction and your right to a refund.

Attention!!! The payment must be done using Money Gram. Click HERE to locate a Money Gram location in your area.

Payment instructions:

1. Make the payment using CASH ONLY (ONLINE CREDIT CARD PAYMENTS ARE NOT ACCEPTED) at your nearest Money Gram location, on our eBay Transaction Agent`s details, assigned for your transaction - Item(s): 2004 Honda Accord EX
First name: Norra
Last name: Freguson
Address : 6309 - 45th Street
City: Leduc
Province : Alberta
Country: CANADA

!!! CLICK HERE TO READ FURTHER INSTRUCTIONS ABOUT MAKING PAYMENTS THROUGH MONEY GRAM.

2. Once the payment was sent, E-MAIL US (by replying to this e-mail) the following information:

a) 8 digits Reference Number
b) Exact Sender's name on file with Money Gram;
c) Your exact address on file with Money Gram;
d) City and country where you sent the money from;
e) Total amount transferred (including fees)
f) Fax us the Money Gram receipt at the following fax number: 408-402-8441

Money Gram Same Day Service is the only service that has ultimate authentication of the identity of the receiver of funds. Several IDs and utility bills are required before the funds are paid. Therefore, no one else but your eBay agent assigned for your transaction can pick up the money. Your payments cannot be lost in the mail, like money orders or checks.

Purchase protection and refund:

Currently, this seller has a 10,000.00usd deposit in an eBay managed purchase protection account. Transactions with this eBay seller are covered by purchase protection against fraud and description errors. For your safety, this account was locked today, for 30 days time period. The seller is unable to withdraw any money from it, within this period.
Should you need a refund for this transaction, the insured amount will be taken from the seller's purchase protection account and sent to you. The way you are refunded is at your choice. You have 30 days from the above verification date to request a refund. Refund requests are processed within 3 days.

The account is managed by eBay's SafeHarbor Team .
This transaction is supervised by eBay's Security Center .
CONDITIONS TO BE MET BEFORE YOU MAY ASK FOR A REFUND
Here are the situations suitable for a refund request:
1) If the item doesn't arrive and/or the seller stops communications after the payment was received;
2) If the merchandise you receive has different specifications than the ones you agreed on;
3) If your merchandise arrives in a much longer period than the one you agreed on (more than 3 days from the payment clearance day);
For cases 2) and 3) you have to send back the merchandise to the seller prior to ask for your refund. If you did not pay the seller by payment method required by us, your refund request will be declined.

Important Usage Guidelines:

1. The contact information should only be used for resolving matters related to eBay. Any other use is strictly prohibited.
2. This transaction is protected by eBay services such as insurance, feedback and dispute resolution.
3. You may buy and sell with confidence in all transactions with this eBay member.
4. Should you need to dispute this transaction, keep the transaction number at hand when contacting eBay. Any complaints must be filed within 30 days from the verification date.

Total Price Sales tax. Shipping Fee Total Price for Buyer
4,000.00 USD
0,00 USD
0,00 USD 4,000.00 USD

Item: 2004 Honda Accord EX-$4.000.00
Buyer : XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Delivery Information:

First name: XXXXXXX
Last name : XXXXXXXXX
Address : XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
City: Milwaukee
State: Wisconsin
Zip : 53212
Country: UNITED STATES

eBay Customer Representative Agent assigned for your transaction:

First name: Norra
Last name: Ferguson
Address : 6309 - 45th Street
City: Leduc
Province : Alberta
Country: CANADA

!!! CLICK HERE TO READ FURTHER INSTRUCTIONS ABOUT MAKING PAYMENTS THROUGH MONEY GRAM.

Seller Details:

First name: Steve
Last name: Robertson
Address : 475 South Maine
City: Ephraim
State: UT
Country: United States

eBay SafeHarbor takes several steps to protect both the Buyer and Seller against fraud:
1. all payments by the Buyer are verified as "good funds" before the Seller is instructed to ship,
2. all shipments are tracked to ensure the Seller shipped and the Buyer received the merchandise,
3. if the merchandise is fraudulent, it gives the Buyer the chance to return the merchandise before payment is released to the Seller.

Once we receive the fax from you that will include the payment details as explained above , we will instruct the Seller to start the shipping process. We will secure your payment until you send us your confirmation that you are satisfied with the product you received. As soon as we receive your confirmation we will release the payment details to the seller.

Our Customer Support Department will verify the transfer and if the payment is available we will notify the seller to proceed with shipping the merchandise.
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:25 am

Hi Kekona
I'm sorry to hear your sister-in-law got scammed like this, unfortunately there is very little she can do. If she doesn't like the idea of going to the police she could file an online report here: http://www.ic3.gov/

If she can find the headers on her computer, she could copy and paste them to you.

Hello I'm New here! Joined: 01 Oct 2005 Posts: 2

Hi Kekona

Jeeze man that's a lotta dough to be out of pocket.So many trusting souls out there,that old saying if it looks to good to be true it ain't sure rings true.I can say here in Canada,Toronto,the cops recently tracked down the scammer in a case similar to your sister inlaws.Don't recall exactly but may have had something to do with Craigslist also.Things are wide open there for people to be duped and that is well known.And they do take it seriously from what i read in the recent news article.

Hard to believe she wouldn't listen to you guys will be a lesson well learned.Not being fascetious i do sympathize man.I say go to the cops and if she does not wanna do it you take the bull by the horns and report it right away.Unless she can throw them kinda bucks away.

Please do report back here and let us know how she or you get along.If she does not report it is just gonna keep simmering in her mind for sure...not good for anyones mental health.

Peace

Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 12:21 am

That's zwaar klote, I still haven't found the right translation for that one, but it isn't good.
Maybe edit the sellers details in your post (if they are real info)
As said above, report it. I don't think the Leduc address is connected to this, just used by them so you might want to warn them that their address is used, they might even be a former victim of the same scam the owner of the address

Hello I'm New here! Joined: 03 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

Hey same exact scammer just got me.. Let me know if you guys have any additional informatin on them. I am going to contact my local police tomorrow and i have filed a complaint with money gram and the federal trade commissoner.. I will get my money back and let your sister in law know that if i find anything else out i will keep you guys posted and help you get your money back.. We need to catch this guy. I am from Missouri though so he is probably going to different states on craiglist posting these cars.

Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:34 am

cmh1205 wrote:

. . . . I will get my money back . . . . . . . . We need to catch this guy. . . . . . .

Sorry to hear that you are another to have lost money.

I'm always angry when I hear that a scammer has taken money from a victim.
The likelihood of the victim ever getting that money back is approximately zero. That's also a cause to be angry.

And, yes, we do need to 'catch this guy' but, unfortunately, the chances of that happening are also approximately zero.

We all need to spend time educating the populace about scams, because we'll never stop the scammers plying their trade whilst their are still victims to be had.

Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:08 am

cmh1205 wrote:

...
I will get my money back
... I am from Missouri though so he is probably going to different states on craiglist posting these cars.

I'm also a "Show Me" from central US.

Sorry, cmh1205, but that money is gone. The scammer is most likely not even in US and possibly not even in Canada.

Hello I'm New here! Joined: 04 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

Goldwing For Sale ..... SCAM
Lots of useful things to look at here... and maybe a little entertaining  Here�s the ad .... http://www.adpost.com/ca/vehicles/12000/
This has been done on Ebay, Craig�s list, AdPost, etc ... etc.. With cars, bikes, trucks.......
I hope no one has fallen for this scam!!!!!!!!!!
I was sending emails to this guy from 2 accounts and he gave me 2 tracking #�s for the same product.
Here are the emails:
I am still leading him on as I do this 
M = Me ...... S = Scammer

Email 1 (these emails were being sent at the same time)

M - Hi,
I am interested in your Goldwing. You must have to get rid of it quick. I was not looking for a bike until the summer but I really love the Goldwings. Is it still available? How can I pick it up? and when?
S - Hi,
If you want to buy the bike, you need to know that the bike is in good condition , never been damaged or involved in any accidents or suffered repaires or else.
Why is the price USD $3500; well the price is low beacuse i need to sell fast and easy.
The bike is located in San Francisco , CA , at a shipping company packed and ready for shipping.
The car was inspected by the shipping company so is in a good condition.
You may ask me why is the bike there. Well the bike is there beacuse right now I moved in England with my work.
If you want to purchase the bike please email me back and i will explain you the process (payment and shipping).

Thank You.
M - I'm interested. What's the process?
S - Hello again,
For payments we will use WorldPay company (www.worldpay.com) , they will secure the transaction for us.
You need to send me back your legal name, legal address and phone number , this info i will send to WorldPay to open a case id#.
WorldPay will contact you with the payment details, you will have to make a deposit of $1500 to WorldPay. They will keep the money secured untill this transaction is ends.
In the same day when you will make the deposit to WorldPay and they confirm that you made the deposit i will shipp the car to your address.
You will get the car with bill of sale , title signed by me in original, manuals and keys.You will have 10 days to inspect the car and decide if you will keep it or not , if you don't like the car then WorldPay will give you the money back in the same day when the shipping company will come and pick up the car. You will pay only the registration of the car to your name. The car will be shipped from San Francisco, CA to your address.
I will wait for your info to start the process .
Thank You.
M - Hi, sounds good.
You keep mentioning car... The Goldwing is a bike....Right?
You don't have any pics, do you?
I'll send the info ASAP.
S � Car
M - It's a car? Do you have a website I can go to to see what that type of car looks like? I thought that it was an 1800cc scooter.
S - :))) no sir is the bike
M - haha...

so this is what it looks like?
I'm interested!

I'm just wondering how this account works: WorldPay company (www.worldpay.com).

$1500 is a fair bit of cash to send for a deposit. I don't know your name or have a number to contact you at. I just want to make sure that I will get the bike.... just a little skeptical

The sooner I get the bike... the better:) I know you are trying to get rid of it quick. I just want to make sure my money is secure.

I understand that the shipping company will send everything to my address, I'd just like to know who I'm purchasing it from. I hope this is not a problem.

S � I will pay all shipping and delivery costs (they are included in the buy it now price).
You need to send me back your legal name, legal address and phone number , this info i will send from shipping company.

I will wait for your info to start the process .
Thank You
S - if u are interested and ready to close the deal i will need you name and address to make the delivery and start the deal .

To make the payment you will need only my full name and adress.

Name :Hans Loc
Adres:132 Church Road
City:London
State:London
Zip:E12 6HL
Country:United Kingdom

payment will be done by www.westerunion.com . and i will be the only one who can get the money !
u will be sure the bike is on your way because i will send the money only afther i give u the traking # so u can see the bike is on your way !

You will send me 50% afther i will provide you the tracking # and the rest of 50% after you will inspect the bike .Before I send the bike i need a confirmation as you are sure to agree for us to close the deal and that you have the money. I want you to be serious about this because I am spending money .

regards
M - Hey,
Sounds great...
So you just need my full name and address for now?
S � Yes
M - Mr. Jack MacDonald
223 Elmsdale Ave.
Battle Creek 269
49017

So when will I have the tracking #?
S - I will give you the traking # in 15 min .
S - Dear Sir i made the shipping here is the traking # 8CLOPLASTZQB you
can truck the shipping on ther website .For more info goo online on
http://www.otopeni-courier.com/.
all you have to do to make the payment via Western Union (money
transfer) not money order is to find a WU agent (i belive your bank has one)
and as for WU formular and complette it with my detials and make the
payment .To make the payment you will need only my full name and adress.

Name :Hans Loc
Adres:132 Church Road
City:London
State:London
Zip:E12 6HL
Country:United Kingdom

After you`ll make the payment u`ll receive a 10 digit number called
MTCN # that you will have to email me along with the sender`s full name
and address . The whole process will take 5-10 min .

And one more thing before you complete the payment , if they will ask for what are you sending money you must tell
them that you are sending money to a friend , because if you will tell them that you are sending money for an
auction they will extra charge me $190 when I will pick up the money .. so please tell them that I am your friend
because i will pay for the shipping and insurance and I don;t want to pay more taxes.

My best regards!
M - Hey .. Sounds great! I can't wait to ride my new bike. Wow I got so lucky finding you on the internet!!! Wow. It's like Christmas!
S - =)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

ok....::((((((((((((((((((((((
M - Are you sure I can't use any other payment method? I have an account in India and it would be easier for write a check to you personally! I feel like I already know you;) So I trust you. I'll send you a check for $6000.... if you send me a money order to my home. Let me know if this is okay.
I hope it will be. It's a win-win situation for us both!

M - oh yeah.. sorry I didn't mention this.. The money order must be made out for $2000. I'd rather not deal with western union.... I had a bad experience before. :(

S - :))))
no onli wu.com

M - I really want the bike!!!!!!!!
There must be some other payment method!
PLEAAAAAAAAAASSSEEEEEEE.
I will send the money ASAP...
My bacnk account in India would be the best for me;)

S - :))))
i scam , you are scam

ok

:D
M - We must be able to work something out! I really would like to have the bike ASAP. It's getting warmer outside. So please... send me the money order for $2000 and I will send you a check for $6000. So... You'll actually be getting $4000. That's a good deal!
Goldwing 4Ever ***

Email # 2
M - Hi,
I just saw your bike ad online. Do you have any pictures?
I am living in Korea but am moving to Canada in a month and a half. I had my scooter stolen and it was my baby :( . Ever since I have been wanting to get another one, but have had to wait until I arrive home.
I was wondering why you are selling i that's okay.
Have a great night and I hope to hear from you.
S - Hi,
If you want to buy the bike, you need to know that the bike is in good condition , never been damaged or involved in any accidents or suffered repaires or else.
Why is the price USD $3500; well the price is low beacuse i need to sell fast and easy.
The bike is located in San Francisco , CA , at a shipping company packed and ready for shipping.
The car was inspected by the shipping company so is in a good condition.
You may ask me why is the bike there. Well the bike is there beacuse right now I moved in England with my work.
If you want to purchase the bike please email me back and i will explain you the process (payment and shipping).

Thank You.
M � (Then I sent him a huge note about transferring the title, picking it up in SF, and a number of other things and I did not hear back from him.....so.....)
M - Hi,
Have you sold it?
S � no I don�t
M - Hello,
That's a pretty good deal for the Goldwing. How long are you going to be in the UK? You must have to get rid of it quickly! Amazing you just wouldn't ship it to yourself.

I'll give you $2800 for it. It's a little too expensive for me.
How can I make a payment to you?
You said it's in good condition, right?
S - The deal will be made in this matter:first of all I will send you the bike and I will give you all the necessary data for you to verify that the bike was sent. After you have verify the information I need to be sure that you agree to close the deal so you have to send me the money through Western Union (money transfer) not money order .You will send me 30% afther i will provide you the tracking # and the rest of 70% after you will inspect the bike .Before I send the bike i need a confirmation as you are sure to agree for us to close the deal and that you have the money. I want you to be serious about this because I am spending money with this shipping because i can't afford loosing this money and I will feel obligated to contact the authorities want the money to be send in 24 h after i will give you the tracking # to see that the shipping is made.This way things will turn out well and also our deal,and I hope we will deal again in the future!!!
M - So, you will take $2500 for the bike?
S - ok..$ 2500 ;)
M - Good Evening.

My Name and address is as follows:
Mr. Ura *DELETED*
69 Back Alley Road
Beverly Hills, Ca
90210

So when can we get his transaction started?
S - I will give you the traking # in 15 min .
S - Dear Sir i made the shipping here is the traking # 03GWX2CIQUX4 you
can truck the shipping on ther website .For more info goo online on
http://www.otopeni-courier.com/.
all you have to do to make the payment via Western Union (money
transfer) not money order is to find a WU agent (i belive your bank has one)
and as for WU formular and complette it with my detials and make the
payment .To make the payment you will need only my full name and adress.

Name :Jack Muller
Adres:132 Church Road
City:London
State:London
Zip:E12 6HL
Country:United Kingdom

Once the payment was sent, email me the following information :
1. 10 digit MTCN (Money Transfer Control Number)
2. Exact sender's name on file with Western Union
3. Your street address on file with Western Union
4. City and country where you sent the money from
5. Amount sent
.

And one more thing before you complete the payment , if they will ask for what are you sending money you must tell them that you are sending money to a friend , because if you will tell them that you are sending money for an auction they will extra charge me $137 when I will pick up the money .. so please tell them that I am your friend because i will pay for the shipping and insurance and I don;t want to pay more taxes.

My best regards!
M - Hi Sir,
So that's all I have to do? And the transaction will be finished? And then the bike will be at my door? I don't know if I trust you:(
I need to be guaranteed I will get the bike... and by the info you've provided, it doesn't seem to be guaranteed.
Is there any alternative?
I imagine you've had a lot of people interested in your bike!!!!!!

Hello I'm New here! Joined: 06 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

k if your looking to find this person what you do is ... trace their ip address or their email source what kind of mailbox do you use outlook yahoo or hotmail

the site that traces their email for free is www.ip-adress.com
if you need help with the process just contact me send me a message

Elite Baiter Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 1043

You can also use the header tool, http://headertool.apelord.com/headers. If you place the header, or just their IP in it, you get their location.

I've found it to be the most accurate out of the few i've tried.

Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:47 pm

I talked to that scammer in that first email, also claiming to be in Ephraim Utah. I suspect these are eastern european scammers running this. I was trying to use up a lot of the scammers time and figure out more on their operation.

They post LOTS of ads on craigslist, for cars way undervalued. I think they just steal photos from car sales sites and put it up under their own fake ads. I think its going to be pretty much impossible to get money back from these people once it is sent. Last one I talked to, claimed the US Air Force would deliver the car at the airport for me..hahaha

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:11 am

Sorry to hear about your sister's loss. It is important for her to file a police report because losses due to fraud are usually tax deductible, so while she won't get her money back, she can probably recoup at least a portion of it that way.

Filing a report at ic3.gov is also a very good thing.

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:35 pm

These scammers must repost these ads thousands of times a day. I see dozens of them up each day on the craigslist section where I live. If anyone wants to have some fun, here is another one, and it is probably the same group that scammed his money earlier, based on the email address

"2002 Toyota Camry XLE

These are great cars and this one will give many years of reliable service. And super gas mileage !! Tires and brakes are excellent. It has just been inspectedand serviced.
I must sell the car very quick and I know the price is a little low.

Flawless factory paint, non smoker interior, clean carpets, and seats, drives like a newer car, it has had exceptional care.

I took great care of this car's exterior, no fade or sun damage. With an interior like this, the only thing that I could call this vehicle is extra clean.

Contact me for more details : [email protected]"