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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:00 am |
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Hey, I am extremely new to this, and have an idea to a bait. However, I am not sure if this is morally alright.
I am the founder of a company that delivers erotic art to adult site. This includes drawings and photos. Maybe even carvings. This idea has some benefits:
1) It is very believable that I want unique art from africa and asia, as porn comes in so many different shapes, and people want to pay for a niche.
2) It is also very believable that I am willing to pay generously for this kind of work, as it is hard for comsumers to get true african erotic art.
3) It will most likely be fairly expensive to produce. You either need an artist (for the paintings/carvings) or a photographer and some models.
4) I will have to ask them do some pretty weird stuff, to be sure that I get some unique art, that is not downloaded from some random site.
5) There are so many good reasons to reject their work. (poor quality, too little varitation, models not beautiful enough, etc.).
6) The product (drawings/photos) can be send by email.
However, I am not sure to go through with this. It does involve some innnocent third parties, but I have seen several baits here that does, and am in doubt what to do.
I don't want to hear stuff like 'porn is disgusting and the work of satan!', or any other crap like that. I don't care what you think of porn, I do however care what you think of the ethics of baiting.
Any input will be appriciated.
EDIT: Spelling |
Last edited by chaos on Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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breadcrumb
Baiting Guru
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 2075
Location: On my knees, licking floors together with TSnerd
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:23 am |
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Hi chaos,
Welcome to eater I see you have already asked for a mentor, so I guess you already had one assigned
Regarding your questions:
Usually we go with the opinion, that it is ok to do this kind of stuff.
I can tell you why: The scammer has to pay the others to do that kind of stuff for him, or he even tells them, that he expects some money from it, or the involved people know that he is a scammer and that he is trying to scam you (in which case, it serves them right anyways).
So if the scammer doesn�t pay them, it would bring him in big trouble with the other ones involved, and this is exactly what we want. Usually the scammers do have some money, so the other ones will get their money for their work from him, may it be voluntarily or by force
So I would say: Go ahead and get yourself some nice porn trophies |
_________________ I´d vote for Don or TS but Lotta, Juan and sheboppe are the best! But the squirrel still sucks on the buttons *g*
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Hoyt
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 25 Feb 2007
Posts: 22
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:37 am |
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One could probably decorate their house with help from their lads |
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Inspector Gadget
Angel of unrealistic meetings
Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 6259
Location: Trumpton
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:33 am |
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Many years ago my brother returned from Spain with a carving of a man in a barrel, about 8 inches high. When you pulled the barrel up 3 thing popped out, 2 where his arms, the other I leave to your imagination. I think this is actually based on a fertility symbol. As a house decoration it would have to be bigger though. |
_________________ x2 Co bait with Rumbero Sao Tome island to Gabon van donation
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Tsnerd
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:19 pm |
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Quote: |
However, I am not sure to go through with this. |
If you have doubts, don't do it.
Quote: |
It does involve some innnocent third parties, but I have seen several baits here that does |
How does your idea involve innocent third parties?
Please provide examples of the several baits that you've seen here that do.
Lastly, thank you for succinctly outlining exactly what types of comments you're looking for, and which you don't want.
That is very refreshing; most members, when asking for advice or help, don't do that. This ultimately leads to comments like, "Porn is disgusting and the work of Satan!"....even in threads that don't involve porn.
Well done. |
_________________
Fakers: many, many, lots; an SSL and a couple of Resellers.
x 6
AH, AH, AH! Two little ! |
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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:35 pm |
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TSnerd wrote: |
If you have doubts, don't do it.
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Or, I can remove the doubt.
Quote: |
How does your idea involve innocent third parties?
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It involves innocent third parties because the lad lad most likely wont pose on the pictures himself, nor will/can he draw or carve. He will have to pay other people to do said things.
Quote: |
Please provide examples of the several baits that you've seen here that do.
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http://www.419eater.com/html/williams_smith.htm
I bet the scammer did not carve that himself. Even if he did, there are several similar baits out there.
Quote: |
Lastly, thank you for succinctly outlining exactly what types of comments you're looking for, and which you don't want.
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No, that was not what I did. At least not what I meant to do. I can accept if people think that getting innocent third parties to pose on pornographic pictures is crossing a line. The scammers might exploid people to get what I ask for, and my concern is: is there a greater risk of hurting innocent third parties when asking for porn, than when asking for carvings of a dog and a cat?
Quote: |
That is very refreshing; most members, when asking for advice or help, don't do that. This ultimately leads to comments like, "Porn is disgusting and the work of Satan!"....even in threads that don't involve porn.
Well done. |
I sense a certain degree of hostility. Why? |
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Scam Patroller
Baiting Guru
Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 11857
Location: UK
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:40 pm |
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Nurse Nasty
Baiting Guru
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 7251
Location: Australia, where a dingo stole my eski
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:09 pm |
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It's not that we're hostile, we're just so incredibly bored with the 'ethics of scambaiting' question.
I understand that you're new, but I promise you the search function here does work. If you do a search for 'ethics baiting' you'll find many threads were new members attempted to reason with this dilemma.
Ethics here can be defined as; We have them. Do we care that some lad had another lad make a piece of art for one of us? Nope. Because the lad that is scamming now owes money to the artist. The artist will be angry. The artist may own a large bat or club. The artist may decide the lad has to pay via a sound flogging or giving up his TV, DVD player, Celine Dion CD's and DKNY designer boxer shorts. It's a circle of life thing.
You're not preaching to the converted. You however want answers, and I doubt any you'll accept any other answer than - 'We don't know if the lad paid for someone to stand in that picture, or build that pyramid, or lay in a bath full of cheetos, or wanked a bull.'
We'd like to think that they did. If they didn't I'd be pretty cranky about not being paid for riding an inflatable donkey or dressing like a Knight of the round table with my pants down. I would want my promised funds. If I didn't get them I'd ask once more before pawning their motorbike and clothes.
So when TSnerd says, 'If you have doubts, don't do it' he's not hostile. He means, 'If YOU have doubts, YOU don't have to do it.' Removing the doubt thingo? I have no idea how you do that.
As long as scammers time and resources have been wasted, and they will pose with cucumbers in their mouths while pouring milk over each other, scam baiting will remain the ultimate email sport. We're just doing our bit to make the world a better place by crushing their will to scam. |
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Tsnerd
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:25 pm |
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Here is the post I made in yesterday's ethics thread:
You wrote: |
I sense a certain degree of hostility. Why? |
I'm not sure. I assure you that there was no hostility in my post.
Rolly-eyed amusement? Certainly.
Sarcasm? Most likely.
No hostility, though. |
_________________
Fakers: many, many, lots; an SSL and a couple of Resellers.
x 6
AH, AH, AH! Two little ! |
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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:26 pm |
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Thanks for your input Nurse Nasty, but I cannot for the life of me figure out if you think I should go ahead and do it, or not. This goes for pretty much every answer in this thread, except for the first one.
It sounds like most of you don't care one way or another, which is probably the truth then. |
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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:30 pm |
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TSnerd wrote: |
Long and short- if it makes you uncomfortable, don't have your lad do it. |
Alright, let me ask in another way then: "Can I post the results on this site?".
Quote: |
I'm not sure. I assure you that there was no hostility in my post.
Rolly-eyed amusement? Certainly.
Sarcasm? Most likely.
No hostility, though. |
Well, thats good... I guess. |
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Tsnerd
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:35 pm |
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Quote: |
It sounds like most of you don't care one way or another, which is probably the truth then. |
Not true.
All of us have lines that we won't cross.
That is up to each baiter to decide and can't be dictated by others.
When I said that if it makes you uncomfortable don't do it, that is exactly what I meant.
If your bait breaks the law or otherwise goes against Forum policies and you try to post it here then we'll step in.
Otherwise it isn't our place to dictate your morality and what you, or any other baiter, may or may not do during a bait. |
_________________
Fakers: many, many, lots; an SSL and a couple of Resellers.
x 6
AH, AH, AH! Two little ! |
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Nurse Nasty
Baiting Guru
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 7251
Location: Australia, where a dingo stole my eski
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:03 pm |
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Saint Arnold
Elite Baiter
Joined: 26 Sep 2006
Posts: 1261
Location: By the kegerator
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:04 pm |
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Maybe this story will help you rest easier with your ethics question. |
_________________ The baiter formerly known as Krona
Our legal team are on standby for the next line of action in this very interesting case.already they are still studying the MTCN number that you sent,it will be used as evidence together with your full names and address,when this epic battle commences. - the one and only Charles Soludo
--------------------------
x15 (RIP) x7 x1
Lottery lad, Benin City - Abuja A new minister, Lagos-Benin City The same minister, Lagos - Tamale, Ghana
Dr. Johnson - Abidjan-Abuja and back again (so far! - 1666 miles round trip)
<----because life can seem bleary and bleak without one. TS
Because Lotta is a great and beautiful mod!
x21 |
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JMRazor
Baiting Guru
Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 7103
Location: Yes
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:15 pm |
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The point is that you'll never know if the lad forced someone at gunpoint to carve a phallus for you so if you are even 1% worried about that possibility, don't do it. Focus instead on straight-baiting which revolves around wasting the time of lads and frustrating them so that they leave real victims alone, or at least have less time to devote to such victims.
That type of activity you can be assured is not harming anyone (well, I suppose they could be holding an internet cafe owner at gunpoint to allow them access to the computer... ), and you'll be able to sleep better at night.
Disclaimer: The above is not to be construed as hostile nor even fertile. You read my posts at your own risk. |
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thud419
Baiting Guru
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 3193
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:39 pm |
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chaos wrote: |
Alright, let me ask in another way then: "Can I post the results on this site?". |
It depends what it is. Nudity is OK, and I imagine most erotic art except photos or extreme stuff would be OK so long as it carried a NSFW tag. (Not Safe For Work ie dont view it where you may get in trouble for it.) We would tend to expect photographic explicit nudity to be masked with blurs, pixelation etc. but a sculpture or painting would probably be OK without. With anything stronger you're probably better off not posting them.
Remember this website has to follow the law, so nothing illegal should be even mentioned.
If you have any doubts when you're about to post, then PM the pictures to Nurse Nasty, who has a strong stomach and will let you know how to handle them.
Good luck. The number of acquired photo trophies with anything stronger than nudity could probably be counted on one hand. It is not easy. On the other hand an 18" carving of Ron Jeremy's wanger may be easier. |
_________________ Click here to feel warm and cozy.
I did not f**k your wife in any way -- Nike Akanbi
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x14
x 0.25 won from Reaper in a sucker's bet
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Jayhawk
Baiting Guru
Joined: 07 Jul 2006
Posts: 5727
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:47 pm |
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Quote: |
Thanks for your input Nurse Nasty, but I cannot for the life of me figure out if you think I should go ahead and do it, or not. |
Based on that reply alone, I would say the answer is a resounding "NO!."
If you are not comfortable, or if you are unsure, don't do it. It really is that simple. |
_________________ x8 < slacking?
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jojobean
Baiting Guru
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 7586
Location: YOU WILL DRINK YOUR URINE IN A COMERCIAL BUS
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:58 pm |
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Do I enjoy a good pr0n bait? Heck yes!
RockSTL and I are baiting this guy that is a complete numpty. The man is a trophy machine. I know for a FACT that this guy is the one who is being baited.
If you would like to see a guy holding his d!ck with a pair of tongs, clicke here: NSFW 1
Here is his collection:
Kevin
Now, RockSTL has convinved this guy he will get paid for this. Do we feel bad that he took his clothes off and made a complete jackass of himself? No. Why? Becuase he was going to rip off a pastor for over $100k.
Most of the guys you see in the pr0n pictures are not little guys. No one would be forcing them to take them.
Also, on the question about the art bait... Big Worm and I are working on one that we know the scammer had to pay another artist to do the work. So what? The artist got paid and everyone is happy. Now, the scammer is selling his laptop to get money for shipping. These artists are not going to do this stuff for free.
SO, in conclusion, my theory is go for it, if you don't feel bad. They are either going to have to pay for someone to take these pictures or make the carvings, or get their legs broken for not paying. A win/win if you ask me. |
_________________
Christ Ghana-Chad
Miracle Benin-Chad
Omar Edo-Abeche
Adamu Lagos-Abeche
Emi - S Africa-Egypt-Sudan 10k miles
Chris Dakar-Niger-BF-Cameroon-Lagos-Mali-Nairobi 9.6k miles
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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 3:00 pm |
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Alright, thank you to everyone who posted here.
I have decided not to proceed with this idea. For now. I might want a little more experience.
Now I just gotta come up with something equally believable. Something that costs 'em money, and wastes their time. I would love to make them travel around the continent to gather dirt for funerals of african imigrants in europe, who wants to get buried in dirt from their birth place.
I dont know if these scammers are aware that it is illegal to import dirt, or at least almost impossible to obtain a permission.
Oh well.
*think think think* |
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jojobean
Baiting Guru
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 7586
Location: YOU WILL DRINK YOUR URINE IN A COMERCIAL BUS
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 3:49 pm |
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Safaris are HUGE time and money wasters. They are my favorite! |
_________________
Christ Ghana-Chad
Miracle Benin-Chad
Omar Edo-Abeche
Adamu Lagos-Abeche
Emi - S Africa-Egypt-Sudan 10k miles
Chris Dakar-Niger-BF-Cameroon-Lagos-Mali-Nairobi 9.6k miles
Kevin Accra- BF x2, Togo x2, Kumasi x3, Bolgatanga, Benin City, Tamale x2 5k miles x 6
Kenny 3k miles- dont f*ck me up about the payment plz. i have a policy about that. I JUST GOT A SMALL GOAT TODAY AND ITS IN MY HOUSE NOW. i lobve the goat.
Ben 2.5k miles
Misc Germany-Holland, Atlanta, Beijing-ChangZhou, London-Glasgow, TIMBUKTU x 2 |
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chaos
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 31
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:04 pm |
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haha, I can see that in your sig. |
Last edited by chaos on Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Inspector Gadget
Angel of unrealistic meetings
Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 6259
Location: Trumpton
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:04 pm |
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If you are open to ideas, you might try to form an African version of an American Football team, if you could fill all the positions you would have 45 players plus coaches heading somewhere for trials. I don't if if you score one safari for each player or one for the whole lot? |
_________________ x2 Co bait with Rumbero Sao Tome island to Gabon van donation
Co bait with Jayhawk and VJD. Stanley's bottle tour Aba to Lagos
Team Hector, airport in installments and St Louis to Kayes
Halil, Cotonou to Accra
+ Precious 10/08/11
x8 x34 x 73
grown up man like him, still doing all this shit games - Stanley, (he doesn't like Parcel Direct)
You again do the strange reflections stuffed with drugs? - Natalia
x3 Hector 24/1/13 Moses 15th Oct 2011
x 2Mick Ole 11th Sept 2014-16 Asare Akuffo start 4th Aug 2014 |
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Slightlyoutofit
Baiting Guru
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 14310
Location: Foraging for Nuts.
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:12 pm |
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What CW didn't tell you is that they're the hardest bloody bait to pull of.
Without kissing his butt too much, I'd say that he is a genius at it and makes it look too easy.
Instead, why not take the advice given here earlier? Go for a straight bait and ease yourself in gently.
If you can pull off a safari first time, then I salute you. But in all honestly, I reckon you're better off working your way up to it. That way you avoid immediate dissapointment and get to learn what you will eventually need to pull off such a big task.
You'll also find that you may even get to know your lads and you'll be able to judge just how far you can push them. It's way better than just walking in cold. |
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luckybugger
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 44
Location: NE Thailand
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:14 pm |
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And you wonder why people are leaving the site?
With TSnerd as a MOD in full sarcastic mode poo pooing a valid question and a long post?
Telling the newbie that there was no hostility but there WAS sarcasm and ridicule? What sort of mod is that?
Me? I thought MODS where there to nurture new baiters and guide them in the right direction - I guess TSnerd has a different view and needs to humiliate them - still, everybody to their own way.
I think I am now banned from the site - BUT there are others!!!!!!!! |
_________________ ''YOU SON OF A BITCH, U FEEL THAT U CAN BE COURSING UR ENTIRE FAMILY WITH UR LOCAL LANGUAGE. TO HELL WITH U , U POOR CHURCHRAT.
BASTARD'' |
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jojobean
Baiting Guru
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 7586
Location: YOU WILL DRINK YOUR URINE IN A COMERCIAL BUS
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Posted:
Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:17 pm |
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I didn't see anything wrong with his post. he did provide him with helpful info, what's the problem?
Chaos didn't seem to take offense to it. |
_________________
Christ Ghana-Chad
Miracle Benin-Chad
Omar Edo-Abeche
Adamu Lagos-Abeche
Emi - S Africa-Egypt-Sudan 10k miles
Chris Dakar-Niger-BF-Cameroon-Lagos-Mali-Nairobi 9.6k miles
Kevin Accra- BF x2, Togo x2, Kumasi x3, Bolgatanga, Benin City, Tamale x2 5k miles x 6
Kenny 3k miles- dont f*ck me up about the payment plz. i have a policy about that. I JUST GOT A SMALL GOAT TODAY AND ITS IN MY HOUSE NOW. i lobve the goat.
Ben 2.5k miles
Misc Germany-Holland, Atlanta, Beijing-ChangZhou, London-Glasgow, TIMBUKTU x 2 |
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