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saralk
Hello I'm New here!
Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 1
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:11 pm |
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Although I can see the irony in asking about the legality of scambaiting when the scammers are committing crimes. The part I am most concerned about, is the part where you ask them to book hotel rooms and other things for you.
In a way, you are getting them to pay money, in a reverse scam, and isn't that in itself illegal, as entrapment?
I am not questioning the ethics of scambaiting, I myself want to start doing this, however, I don't want to find myself in some sort of legal mess because I tried to be a vigilante. |
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MaxPonage
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 01 Sep 2006
Posts: 30
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:16 pm |
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How can you get into a legal mess? The only possible way for you to get caught is for the scammer to report you, and in order to do that, he/she would have to admit to scamming you. |
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homer_seshel
Wannabe Baiter
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 90
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:18 pm |
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Someone correct me if I am wrong here, but as far a legality is concerned, what we do is not considered to be illegal unless we were benefitting financially at the end. We do not participate in what is referred to as "cashbaiting". We do not have them send us money. Having a lad spend their money is not illegal. They have the choice to spend that money if they wish. What we do is mainly waste their time and cost them as much money as we possibly can. The only benefit that we get out of it is the entertainment value, and of course knowing that as long as they are concentrating on us, they are not scamming a victim that actually falls for their scam. |
_________________
Good Sister Mary: please do you have any money to send to me i m in big sheet here |
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Mr Fishe
Baiting Guru
Joined: 22 Nov 2003
Posts: 2242
Location: PL_Goldrush
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:22 pm |
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If you have concerns, it�s pretty simple: don�t do anything you are not comfortable with. There are plenty of other ways to waste a scammer�s time without asking for hotel bookings. |
_________________ Lads love forms!
Magic eye fun: Western Union MoneyGram
Pre-transfer red tape: Department of Homeland Security HM Revenue & Customs
Mandatory customer survey: Western Union
"I have decided to leave the church and join a travelling circus..." - the original and best |
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Tsnerd
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:24 pm |
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It's simple:
Don't do anything illegal- no cashbaiting, no bodily fluids/substances in the mail, no pipebombs, and no email virii or trojans.
As for:
Quote: |
because I tried to be a vigilante. |
Is that what you think baiting is? |
_________________
Fakers: many, many, lots; an SSL and a couple of Resellers.
x 6
AH, AH, AH! Two little ! |
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Nurse Nasty
Baiting Guru
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 7251
Location: Australia, where a dingo stole my eski
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:34 pm |
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I'm just really happy you see the irony in asking about the legality of scambaiting when the scammers are committing crimes.
If the worse I do is get some moron scammer to waste all his money of hotel booking and trips across his country it's seems a small price compared to the money lost and lives destroyed by their crimes.
Besides it's not illegal for scammers to spend their money. Just because I wove a web of creative deceit, doesn't mean I MADE him do it. I call that poetic justice. I'd love to see a lad try and sue one of us.
Also we're not vigilantes. We're bounty hunters. I get paid for this.... umm... doesn't everyone? |
_________________ [Support 419Eater] l [Get Premium!] l [Helpful stuff] l [ScamWarners]
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Marvin
*** BANNED ***
Joined: 20 Aug 2005
Posts: 620
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:48 pm |
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^^^^ An awful lot!
Some people say that what we do as baiters can be "quasi-legal" which is very far removed from "illegal". We do have law enforcement officers and other members of the legal services (real lawyers!) amongst the membership.
There have been many discussions on the ethics of baiting, you should read them especially the sticky most eloquently(?) written by Shiver.
At the end of the day you must make your own mind up, but please do it armed with knowledge, don't just take someone's word for it. Moral and ethical decisions need understanding and due consideration, if you are unhappy with some of the simple things we ask lads to do because it involves them "spending money" then baiting really is not for you.
If you ask a lad to book a hotel room for you the very last thing he is going to do is put his hand in his own pocket for you. At the best he will use a stolen CC, they do that more than you may realise. The market is huge and brisk.
Scammers do what they do of their own free will (some will argue about that point). So do we! The difference is they're acting in a criminal manner we're trying to stop them.
This is not a game, this is war! |
_________________ Marvin "Your Plastic Moron Who's Fun To Be With."
I'm just a stupid troll.
Last edited by Marvin on Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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loading...
Master of Master Baiters
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 690
Location: 127.0.0.1
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:48 pm |
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just remember that they dont have to do anything we ask of them, they have a choice but they do it because they see it a mean to scam money. whats a photo with a fish on your head if you get $5500 for it? |
_________________ go you polkhead, FULK- albert john
I AM THE KING OF SCAMMARS...I WILL GET YOU SOME DAY. -olivier kabah
i can pay $1,0000000 to get your cops to hell - jacob wilson
lagos to douala "i am tired of roaming west africa"
i like pretty flags. want your own?
46X 10X 8X 5X 5X 5X 4X 4X 4X 3X 3X 3X (???) 2X 2X 2X and a sierra leone diamond site.
x9
Nurse Nasty needs a new endoscope. Donate! |
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Duncan Disorderly
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 29 Jul 2006
Posts: 21
Location: UK
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:49 pm |
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.... and the chances of one of them hopping on a plane to UK to make a statement to the police accusing you of a crime are pretty remote too |
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Novice Navis
Wannabe Baiter
Joined: 14 Aug 2006
Posts: 88
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:50 pm |
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Quote: |
I get paid for this.... umm... doesn't everyone? |
A wealthy Iranian businessman dying from esophageal cancer offered me USD $2,000.00 for each scammer scalp I sent to him. But now I have to pay demurrage fees... |
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Dinnertime Mbuzo
Account closed at users request
Joined: 13 Dec 2005
Posts: 559
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:51 pm |
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Off topic, but thats a great username Dunc. |
_________________ samuel johnson said OH BOY NA GOD GO PUNISH UR PAPA ASSHOLE, GOAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
then samuel johnson added UR PILE DEY CRAZE
I BE UR PAPA MATE, TELL UR PAPA TO GO CASH THE PAY SO EFCC GO NAB IM ASSHOLE, AND IM MORTHERFUCKING ASSHOLE GO TEY FOR THE MUTHERFUCKING PRISON FOR MUTHRFUCKING 100YEARS.
alvin bakare asked what is the meaning of what you sent to me,a sexual picture?
Peter Bongo said What is this you are doing? Have you forgotten that i am Peter Bongo.
Ovo said I AM FROM NIGERIA
ATTARCH HERE IS MY PICPURE
HOW CAN I GET THE MONEY? |
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homer_seshel
Wannabe Baiter
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 90
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 8:57 pm |
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Actually for the "getting paid for doing this".... if you count all of the lotteries that I have won, I should be a gazillionair by now! |
_________________
Good Sister Mary: please do you have any money to send to me i m in big sheet here |
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GeneralAbacha
419Eater is my life
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 301
Location: Canada
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 9:04 pm |
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Entrapment? No. Entrapment is not something that one (e.g. a baiter) could be charged with., rather it is a defence against prosecution, i.e. where an accused claims to have been lured, generally by an agent of the state, into a previously uncontemplated criminal act. |
_________________ x2
Also she said that we need to organized some girls for a lesbian club here , then we will used them and make money , but it will needs some financial support , that if you are here with us that it will be more easy to organized . I know some big girls here that in this lesbian club , they have nice sports car and live in good bungalow.
- Joyce Organ
I WOULD ADVICE YOU TO WRITE JUSTICE AMADU BELLO AND APPOLOGISE TO HIM, YOU SHOULD TELL HIM WHY YOU ARE SCARED IS BECAUSE OF THE BELLO IN HIS NAME. YOU SHOULD TELL HIM TO FIND YOUR HUSBAND FROM THE HANDS OF HOSTAGEER AND ARREST USMAN BELLO AND THE HOSTAGE GANGS.
-Charles Soludo |
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Marvin
*** BANNED ***
Joined: 20 Aug 2005
Posts: 620
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 9:13 pm |
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When the SAPS were co-operating with the baiting community entrapement was a big issue and certain things could not be done in baiting the lads to get a conviction.
Entrapement laws vary greatly from country to country |
_________________ Marvin "Your Plastic Moron Who's Fun To Be With."
I'm just a stupid troll. |
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Yastreb
Common Street Thawth Vergabon
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 17388
Location: Leading my wolf pack
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 10:11 pm |
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As I understand it, given that the Lad approaches you (albeit via a mass emailing), it's can't be entrapment in the first place.
The nature of entrapment is that it must involve an innocent party being drawn into the commission of an offence s/he would not have committed without the action of the entrapper. I don't see how that could apply to the baiter.
(Of course, as Marvin said, entrapment laws vary over the world, but deep down that principle would remain... right?)
I don't know where that leaves those who harvest a Lad from the spare Mugu thread, though. |
_________________ Son of a bitch!!! Your dead!!! Everything about your stinking poor life is dead!!! Get off my way you son of a bitch mother ....a man without father bastard....your dead Ok
May you never se the end of the year, May you sick and die in JESUS NAME AMEN.
MARK MY WORD, YOU SHALL FALL SICK, IF YOU DONT PLEASE WITH ME, YOU SHALL DIE OF THE SICKNESS, THIS IS MY FINAL WORD TO YOU
I HAVE PLACED YOU UNDER MY ORACLE GODS,
YOU SHALL CRY AND BEG FOR FORGIVENESS OR YOU DIE
x5 x2 x 246
x 5 - Oyenka Chidinma Lagos-Cotonou; Dickyboi Lagos-Accra; Femmy Lagos-Porto Novo; "Woody" Accra-Singapore; Henry Philip Abuja-Natitingou w/MG & DSW
x 7 |
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Tsnerd
Not quite a Newb
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 10:25 pm |
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Well, unfortunately, they're screwed.
They can expect knocks on the door now anyday from the Internet Enforcement and Fairness Enforcement people.
Harassment.
Picking on a lad.
Dirty language.
Misuse of goat porn.
The list goes on and on.
...poor bastards and bastardettes. |
_________________
Fakers: many, many, lots; an SSL and a couple of Resellers.
x 6
AH, AH, AH! Two little ! |
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Toussaint Tatsugi
Master of Master Baiters
Joined: 25 Jun 2005
Posts: 814
Location: AS SEEN ON TV!!
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Posted:
Sat Sep 02, 2006 10:38 pm |
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I would be real happy to march into any Court in the World having pulled a lad from the spare mugu files and argue that it was not entrapment... the letter was originally sent out indiscriminantly by the lad, ergo he has no legal footing if his litter is picked up by someone other than the massive list he sent it to, and since everything he says and promotes with that email is false to begin with- he has no legal footing to complain that he has been duped in any way.
It's like the bank robber who demands $25,000 and complains to the judge after his arrest that he was cheated by the bank because they only gave him $10,000 during the robbery.
Other than that- the personal boundaries issue has been addressed eloquently by those above me. Do only what you feel personally comfortable with, don't vilate the social principles that we have established for the community, and stay safe at all times. Just because I am willing to go so far as to suggest they will prove themselves to me if they gargle bleach doesn't mean that is suitable for you. |
_________________ I AWAITING YOUR REPLY AS YOU SAID TO CONSULT THE TIKI, I WANT YOU TO DO SO ASAP <james>
I WILL NOT BE INVOLVED IN ANY ATTEMPT TO DISTABILIZE AN ESTABLISHED GOVT BY ANY GUERILLA MEANS AS IT IS SINFUL AND AGAINST THE WILL OF GOD. <richard>
The road to greatness and goodworks in life is not an anus one can open with one palm. <Rev. Joe>
pls send me that money i need mr .pls for the sack of God ok .thank u <mother sandra>
you are mad not to know that as a renowned international lawyer with wide knowledge on mysticism I can remote control your inner man to yield to complete madness <arman>
x9 |
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rumbero
Baiting Guru
Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 3677
Location: All the Salsa Night Clubs
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:01 am |
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Entrapment ??????
There is no entrapment from the baiters. We are just simply following the request of the mugus to ensure that their scam turns out to be 100 % risk free. They want money, we give them money.
What else would a mugu want. |
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Novice Navis
Wannabe Baiter
Joined: 14 Aug 2006
Posts: 88
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:31 am |
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To be honest, I usually just fake the WU forms to humiliate them. I can't afford to send a lad real money. |
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Gnasher
Baiting Guru
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 2849
Location: Centre Stage in the Theatre of Cruelty
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:56 am |
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If you are baiting safe as a fictitious character in a country other than the one you actually live in and using fake details with anonymous and untraceable email address - which you should be - how the hell is a lad going to report you in the first place? If he decides to book a hotel room for a person who does not exist that's his problem. |
_________________ x21
"you have to pay because he need to submit this form to the Federal Ministry Of Fancies" Barrister John/Mike/Richard Okeke
"they are in deed the swinders rotating about in the net and searching for whom they will stylishly defraud your belongings" A. Moron
"Please pray harder for God to guide and protect us during our travelling because flight airplane i observe is a very big risky" Abdul Karibu
"WE DOESN'T LIKE HOW DISOBIDIENT YOU ARE!" Coco Law Chambers
"BE INFORMED THAT YOU WILL INCUR DUMMERAGE AFTER 9 DAYS FROM TODAY" Burkina Faso Air Secure Air Service.\ |
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SlayerFaith
Baiting Guru
Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5778
Location: Vegas, baby!
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:38 am |
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Novice Navis wrote: |
To be honest, I usually just fake the WU forms to humiliate them. I can't afford to send a lad real money. |
PLEASE tell me that was a joke! |
_________________ x2 x24 x7 x5 x5 x96 x2 x2 x2 x2 x2 x2 x3 x3 x2 x2 (in a team effort)
ANIMAL,MY FRIEND MY PRAYER IS THIS,LET ALL MY ENEMIES BE IN TROUBLE LIKE CHRIST INGIGE,AND LAZY PEOPLE LIKE YOU BE LIKE WABARA.THANK YOU- Kelechukwu Nduka
"Did he say they have an inflatable pig? That's sick!"- Crash, Vegas 06
"You can be a right Bitch sometimes SF"- Cherrie, GenChat 07
Naked Mod pics!
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Bowline
Hello I'm New here!
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Posts: 13
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:58 am |
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Here's my take. If you just "play along" with the scam, do what ever they ask you (only wrong), and basically waste their time and whatever money is incidental to their plans (including hotels and such), I can't imagine any law you would be breaking.
But, if you offer them money and then don't pay when they keep their end of the bargain (e.g. "meeting" you 100 miles away, riding a goat naked, or whatever) then basicaly you have started a whole seperate scam. The only difference is that you know it's a scammer you're targeting. But I don't see how that would make a difference legally.
If you're not profiting, it might not be criminal, but I think they would be (legally) justified to sue you for expenses.
Of course they know they're criminals so it's highly unlikely they would go to the law for help, even if they could figure out who you are. |
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rumbero
Baiting Guru
Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 3677
Location: All the Salsa Night Clubs
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:08 am |
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You mean I would be responsible for having my potential future models pay for professional photo shoots. |
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Novice Navis
Wannabe Baiter
Joined: 14 Aug 2006
Posts: 88
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:28 am |
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SlayerFaith wrote: |
Novice Navis wrote: |
To be honest, I usually just fake the WU forms to humiliate them. I can't afford to send a lad real money. |
PLEASE tell me that was a joke! |
???
You mean, you don't fake the WU forms? I thought Shiver Metimbers did it that way. I mean, what's the point of sending your mugu real money? It ceases to be a bait and then it turns into a successful scam on their part, which is what we're trying to stop, right? |
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SlayerFaith
Baiting Guru
Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5778
Location: Vegas, baby!
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Posted:
Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:38 am |
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^^^^
What I meant was, tell me the part about wanting to send them them real money is a joke. From your response, I can see that it is.
As for sending fakey WU forms... applications... psychological tests, handwriting analysis samples, personality profiles, the more the merrier! |
_________________ x2 x24 x7 x5 x5 x96 x2 x2 x2 x2 x2 x2 x3 x3 x2 x2 (in a team effort)
ANIMAL,MY FRIEND MY PRAYER IS THIS,LET ALL MY ENEMIES BE IN TROUBLE LIKE CHRIST INGIGE,AND LAZY PEOPLE LIKE YOU BE LIKE WABARA.THANK YOU- Kelechukwu Nduka
"Did he say they have an inflatable pig? That's sick!"- Crash, Vegas 06
"You can be a right Bitch sometimes SF"- Cherrie, GenChat 07
Naked Mod pics!
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