Africa wants polluters to pay for climate change

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Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 6:55 am

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20091011/wl_africa_afp/africaclimateenvironmentwarmingunau

Hmm, i wonder where all those money will go.

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:02 am

Hmm. Corrupt, lazy, greedy officials demanding the more successful give them money in retribution for an imaginary wrong. That sounds so familiar, but I can't quite place it...

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:10 am

@NickTheCop
Exactly my thoughts.

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:36 am

We're already pouring billions into Africa, with little or nothing to show for it.
Didn't I read of an African economist arguing that this policy did more harm than good, a while back?

Hellish Taskmaster Joined: 31 Dec 2008 Posts: 537

I believe in global warming, but there are alternatives.

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Mr Tambourine Man wrote:

Didn't I read of an African economist arguing that this policy did more harm than good, a while back?

It goes back to that give-a-man-a-fish/teach-a-man-to-fish story. It goes without saying that I'm no qualified economist, but a simple observation of what is and has happened is sufficient for me to confirm that statement. But hey, if they can squeeze a little more blood out of the "guilty, imperialist West", I guess they'll try.

Baiting Guru Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 18313

Moved to General Chat from Main Scambaiting.

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:43 pm

We have the same "Blame it on the West" syndrome here as well.

The Cateret Islands have been substantially damaged since 1945 by dynamite fishing on the coral reef, plus the fact it is part of the Pacific Plate that is sinking under the Austro/Indo Plate, but they insist it is the sea rising.

Then we have Tuvalu and Kiribati, where 1/3 of the island was dug out to make an airfield, pits were dug for the rubbish, the trees and palms were cleared to make room for more houses, but it is the sea rising that is causing the damage.

The only problem I have with this, is that how do you make the sea rise only on 2 separate islands, without affecting adjacent Islands?

Plus they want compensation and Tuvalu is at present pursuing a World Court case against Western nations asking for several billion in compensation.

Bah humbug and more words of similar ilk to Al Gore

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:51 pm

Here we blame it on many others: the West, the East Laughing

Well, mostly on Hitler, Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin.

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

Couldn't have said it better myself, Nick. I will leave it at that before I launch a scathing attack on GSN_fan for this comment:

Quote:

I believe in global warming

Carry on...

Not quite a Newb Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 29

^^Yeah, I was going to attack him too. I mean since Global Warming is a scientific fact, rather than an opinion, it's not really something one can choose to believe in. That statement is akin to saying you believe in gravity or believe the earth is a sphere.

Some people!

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:00 pm

Keep on topic, please.

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:11 pm

OK... there are many countries on other continents with the same climate problems. The whole tropics belt, as a matter of fact.
Did they asked billions of dollars of compensations? I think not. At least not many of them.

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

That is because the Tropics are not full of corrupt officials. I can only echo what's already been said. Corruption is rife, and it's unfortunate Westerners have to pay for their lifestyle while their people are in dire conditions.

Not quite a Newb Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 29

Not sure what you mean by the "tropics belt" since Ouagadougou, the dateline city of the article you posted, lies at 11 degrees North, firmly within the tropics.

But then I'm also not sure if you or most of the others commenting in this thread actually read the posted article before launching into your tired "those damn third worlders bring everything upon themselves" polemics.

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

Of course we've read it. They are complaining that they receive 80% of the effects of climate change, so want compensated.

To me, that is an excuse for officials to squeeze more money out of our increasingly lefty Governments. The officials are clever, they see we are weakening, so they pounce.

Not quite a Newb Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 29

Craig007 wrote:

That is because the Tropics are not full of corrupt officials.

Partial list of African nations wholly or partially in the tropics: Nigeria, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Congo (both of them), Chad, Angola, Zambia, Somalia, Ethiopia, Eritrea, Central African Republic, Sierra Leone. . .

I am torn between asking if your statement was meant to indicate that none of these nations have corrupt governments or pointing out that while you may have read the article you apparently have difficulty reading maps. But why choose.

(Edited: spelling and such)

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:35 pm

By the tropics belt I mean those latitudes between the two tropics. Precisely between 23deg N and 23deg S.

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:38 pm

@Magnolia
Tropics are not reduced to Africa. They circle the Earth.

Not quite a Newb Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 29

^^That is the definition of the tropics, yes. And a very large portion of Africa, where the meeting referenced in the article took place (including the city in which it took place), lies within the tropics, thus your argument that the tropics aren't complaining (unlike, presumably, those referenced in the article) makes little sense.

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

Quote:

I am torn between asking if your statement was mean to indicate that none of these nations have corrupt governments or pointing out that while you may have read the article you apparently have difficulty reading maps. But why choose.

Now we're bordering on insulting, which there is no call for.

I can read a map. If I couldn't read a map, I wouldn't be allowed to work. I was using the COLLOQUIAL definition of the "Tropics", not the technical one.

To me, that would indicate the Caribbean, Indonesia, Brazil. Some African countries, but only with rainforest.

That's the definition I was working on, but since we all seem to be geographers, I'll specifically state exactly where I mean from now on.

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:41 pm

@Magnolia
I did not heard of complaints&demands of this kind from South&Central America or from South Asia&Oz.

Not quite a Newb Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 29

@KS: How many articles have you read on the impacts of climate change? If you haven't heard about it elsewhere, it could be that you haven't read enough about the subject.

Beyond that, I'm not sure exactly what you find admirable about people who are suffering environmental degradation brought about largely by others not asking for assistance to ameliorate the effects of that degradation. Or are you such a pacifist that you think it's admirable to stand by while someone beats you to death. Or, for example, for someone in the Maldives or Bangladesh to stand by quietly while their land is drowned by rising sea levels.

As for the importance or non-importance of definitions -- personally I find it difficult to make or accept an argument if the person doing the arguing chooses to apply their own special definitions to their terms. If you meant that you think it's only parts of Africa that act in the way you claim they do, then come out and say that.

Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:57 pm

In Oceania, there's Kiribati, Tuvalu, and the Carterets, all of whom are claiming against the hypothesis of AGW, but have caused their own problems, or are being destroyed by plate tectonics.

But don't let empirical evidence confuse a good bun fight

more popcorn?

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

Quote:

you think it's admirable to stand by while someone beats you to death.

Enough. I'm withdrawing from this conversation before I have to be dragged away by the mods, in the usual manner.

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