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 Romanian Scam with US Brain Control

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cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:26 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi,
I am a former scamer with a romanian scam and I realy enjoy this site. I worked for the scamers about one year and I left them more than two years ago.
The scam was a masterpiese in the field. The brain was of course a real smart guy from US and I learned a lot of sales technique from him.
I'm happy to share this info with you because I read lots of scam baiting and I'm not fully agree. Anyway, nigerian scams are very poor and not well organized...
When I was a scammer (BTW it was a telemarketing scam) I used to call about 150 people per night, and that was enough to find 2-3 buyers. We were working in a calling center (about 50 sales-persons), and the sales average was 10.000USD a day.
I left the field because I graduated, and now I'm working as an IT Manager for a large company.
So, let me give you a clue about how stuff works in a poor country. My comision when I scamed was about 800$/month and my salary now as an IT specialist is 300$/month.
Anyway, here is the perfect place to talk about scam and scamers, isn't it?
Everybody get scamed sometime somehow an this is done even through e-mail or phone, television or newspapers, politics and tax law...and it just depends on how smart the scam is buid and performed.
ScamTech
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Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 514
Location: New Zealand


PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:05 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Welcome to the board. Very Happy

It must be hard not to be lured back into scamming when you aren't making as much money now.

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Guest







PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:09 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Welcome to the board. Smile
buried under 419 emails
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:25 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I have to agree in part that everyone gets scammed. I seem to notice that people get scammed in certain areas, and not in others.

Some people are never scammed for money, but are scammed in personal relationships. For others they never get scammed on relationships, but never money. I guess that you canít totally divorce the two many times money and relationships are tied together.

Anyway welcome to the board.
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Tweety
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Joined: 24 Dec 2003
Posts: 3095
Location: The Netherlands


PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:43 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Welcome to the board indeed.

I applaud that you are willing to work as an IT specialist for only $300,- while you could make thrice that with scamming. I have a friend in Romania who is trying to survive there as a computer programmer. He has told me about the difficult situation in your country.

Welcome again Cool

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Euro
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Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 18
Location: BS - UK - EU


PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Good that you have given up Scamming - even if it means less money - but I guess it's honesty that counts at the end of the day.

But anyway, good to have you onboard! Twisted Evil

Euro

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muguru
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Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 20
Location: Europe


PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 11:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
Everybody get scamed sometime somehow an this is done even through e-mail or phone, television or newspapers, politics and tax law...and it just depends on how smart the scam is buid and performed.


I agree. I have been scammed (small amounts of money too) and the feeling to get scammed is awful. And its hard to even admit "I've been scammed." And what you're saying about 419 scams not beeing well organised, my opinion is that if someone tries to bait stupid people, they end up baiting stupid people. Smart scammers can easily avoid "fun baiting" (opposite of "serious baiting"). AND its very sad to see that even stupid scammers can be succesful - well, what does that tell about the scammed people? Sometimes its just easy to fall in to scam: financial situation is poor, suffer mental problems...

And still what I'm trying to do is "fun baiting". Baiting mugus. Why? I'm not good at this, but I still feel that I can eat their resources and maybe save 0.01 people from a scam.

I hope you stay on this board. Welcome!
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cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 1:12 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi everyone,
Thanks for your great wellcome!
I already own some answers Wink so I would better answer quick...
I left the "diploma meal" for less money, cause I was exposed to a quite hard life-altering phenomen... hard to explain.
Money are an easy think to understand, but making money out of people using mental manipulation is powerfull drug.
"There are 100.000 brend new leads, call that people and take the money from them. That money are yours and they keep it in their poket. Call them and take the money that you deserve"...this was the sales manager words.
So it is hard to imagine how deep these words can go into a mind of some poor people where the real value is taint.

Than it comes:....

A perfect scamer is actualy saling a dream while his is comming true
A powerfull pitch and somebody will fall into your trap and IT's PAY DAY.
As a scamer I learned to pass very quick on people witch are suspicious(it's like card tricks...you can't do them to people who are interesting in revealing the secret rather than "magic"). And it's one more point: Mathematics: you talk to 100 people and 2 will buy, so as quick as you pass the suspicious ones as soon as you catch the "gold fish".
Scamer's number one rule: "The customer is a liar"
Rule numer two: "He/she will pay". This sentence must not exist in scamer's manual. The only sentence that is true is "I got the money!"

Laughing

I received myself an e-mail from a nigerian scam and I played a little with him, I even gaved him my phone number and he called several times.
I asked as a proof some void check, but no reactions.
The "bussines" that I worked for never sent out anything and any customer that asked for anything to be sent out, even through e-mail was just ignored,

Be right back...
Guest







PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 1:31 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
"The customer is a liar"


That's similar to my motto "The demon is a liar Damien". You know how to tell when a lad is lying? His lips are moving. Same goes for his fingers on a keyboard.
cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 2:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

frontline wrote:
That's similar to my motto "The demon is a liar Damien". You know how to tell when a lad is lying? His lips are moving. Same goes for his fingers on a keyboard.


"The Demon is a liar. He will lie to confuse us. But he will also mix lies with the truth to attack us. The attack is psychological, but powerful. So don't listen, remember that, do not listen. "

I like that myself...and it seems that we do like playing hard
Cool
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 2:40 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I'll play dirty and hard with the lads until my bones are showing through my knuckles. There's no reason to pussyfoot around. I'm bigger, I'm badder, I'm rougher, I'm tougher. They're scumbags and cowards, I have no reason to fear them.
Oz_Baiter
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Joined: 25 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 2:44 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

To paraphrase a great movie!

The greatest trick the devil pulled is proving he didnt exist!

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cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:05 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

frontline wrote:
I'll play dirty and hard with the lads until my bones are showing through my knuckles. There's no reason to pussyfoot around. I'm bigger, I'm badder, I'm rougher, I'm tougher. They're scumbags and cowards, I have no reason to fear them.


Thanks God I have a Complete Edition of Penguin Dictionary including all the slang, insult, cuss and curse in english Laughing

"England, the heart of a rabbit in the body of a lion. The jaws of a serpent, in an abode of popinjays."
Eugene Deschamps

I agree with you that they are scumbags, but what about their "clients"?! Are they different as long as they send the money thinking that they make a fortune without work? At the end they can't even go to authorites to claim a fraud because they can't say what deal was about...i guess...
Euro
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Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 18
Location: BS - UK - EU


PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:08 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

the clients are different....

Things bad about these people:

Scammer - he scams!
Victim - he is a fool.

Anyone who believes in such a windfall is a total idiot - money doesn't grow on trees, and both you and I know that! Laughing

Euro

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cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:21 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Actualy I think that the person doing the trusting is a chowderhead, a cum bubble, a patsy..... Laughing

I hate the scamers but i'm interesed in their techniques... Evil or Very Mad
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:23 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

As far as the victims go, yes they are stupid and naive and greedy, but they are still victims of crime. Just because one doesn't understand the technology they're using is no reason for people to take advantage of that fact. You have stated that you were a phone scammer, that is yet another example of this. Knowledge is power, and the more people who know about the lads the better. Same thing goes for phone scams. Pretty soon the generation gap will close and all scammers on the internet will get shut down.

I also don't understand your need to belittle England in your post. Do you not like England? Please explain.
cortesenln
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:42 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

frontline wrote:
As far as the victims go, yes they are stupid and naive and greedy, but they are still victims of crime. Just because one doesn't understand the technology they're using is no reason for people to take advantage of that fact. You have stated that you were a phone scammer, that is yet another example of this. Knowledge is power, and the more people who know about the lads the better. Same thing goes for phone scams. Pretty soon the generation gap will close and all scammers on the internet will get shut down.


I don't think that the scam will end...and I assume that it will grow more than now and the scam methods will develop based on our feedback.
I'm repeting myself when I said that I sold "dreams"....People like dreaming and they are ready to pay good money for this. "Scam" is a vaste word and include anything that I can take from you using a cheating method. Even ususal TV advertising is sometimes SCAM.

frontline wrote:

I also don't understand your need to belittle England in your post. Do you not like England? Please explain.


I was in London 3 times I have friends there and I like England and their people. Self-warning Smile
Guest







PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:55 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
I don't think that the scam will end...


Yes it will, all of us will make sure of that. The difference between a 419 scam and a TV scam is that most people are aware about TV scams and are far less likely to fall for them. Neither one is excusable.

I'm sorry if I misunderstood your post about England. Smile
Lew_Skannen
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Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 2084
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I will welcome you when you pay back what you stole.

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SamV
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:48 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I sort of agree with Lew - or, at least, stop talking about your victims like they deserved it, and commit to doing something to get your former compatriots brought to justice. This forum is about fighting scam artists - not justifying them.

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Meaghan Beaghan
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:59 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

cortesenln wrote:

Everybody get scamed sometime somehow an this is done even through e-mail or phone, television or newspapers, politics and tax law...and it just depends on how smart the scam is buid and performed.


It doesnt make it right Sad

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Tor
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:08 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I'll second that Meaghan.. there is a thin line between inmorall and illegal, and to my eyes both are wrong.

Off course, being honest and upstanding don't make you rich - but it will make sure you have good friends and a clean mind, as well as ending up a place that isn't searing hot when you die if you believe in such things.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Scamming, multilevel marketing, and hard-close sales are all form of psychological manipulation based ultimately on brainwashing techniques.

IMO, two of the biggest "legit" con jobs going on in the world are The Church of $cientology and Amway. Both sell a dream and both use sophisticated mind control techniques and hard sell tactics. $cientology sells the dream of enlightenment and Amway sells the dream of wealth. Both enlightenment and wealth = happiness and immunity from life's problems in the minds of people who lack either or both. If you ever want a mind-bending read, go study Scientology at somewhere such as http://xenu.net

You can search and find sites for disaffected Amway people. Both CoS and Amway use a battery of attornies to actively get such sites taken down and usually succeed in the US. Fortunately, Europe, especially the Scandanvian countries, remain bulwarks of free speech on the internet.

That we have a former telemarketing scam artist here is great. At least we can talk to an ex-crook who has gone straight. At least he is now earning an honest living.

The FBI and Interpol do hire ex-cons for their expertise and often give them immunity for their past crimes in exchange for their help in catching other criminals. Shouldn't we accord cortesenln an informal immunity so that we can learn from him? At $300 a month how could he ever hope to repay his victims? Does he even know who they are? If part of our goal is to educate the public, then an ex-scammer's inside information is an asset.
Maybe his inside knowledge could serve as his repayment to society.

I was once arrested on a drug possession charge, a felony way back when, and had to pay a debt to society. Thank God people did not hold it against me forever. Thank God the charge was reduced to a misdemeanor because the quantity was so small and my future was not marred by a felony arrest record. I too wound up going to college and became a productive, honest member of society as it appears cortesenln is attempting to become. I honor his efforts at self-reformation because I was once a convicted criminal. My conviction was expunged after a number of years and my record was sealed.
lister von smegg
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

the movie Glengarry glen ross comes to mind after reading this thread.

where i live these "call centers" are rife. and most of the employees are students. most last only untill they find either a better job or just can`t take it anymore. the real criminals are the ones who run them. forgive and forget i say.

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Lew_Skannen
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:39 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Well J.Dog it sounds like you have some regrets for your actions and feel you have learnt a lesson and paid back a debt to society etc.

I don't see much in the way of remorse from our new member:

Quote : I left the field because I graduated,
(no other reason)

Well it is good that he is not scamming and maybe even making some effort to counter scammers but I still can't say I am feeling particularly warm and fuzzy.

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