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 Are scammers getting smarter or not?

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Namwan
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Joined: 20 Apr 2013
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Location: Bangkok, Thailand


PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:16 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I've been reading the letters archive section of the website for most of today and I noticed that a lot of them were from 2004-2006. While I understand that the scammers might be fooled back then, what I don't understand is why they don't learn from their mistakes and realize that a reply that goes something like this (such as being an owner of a company and requiring the scammer to do something) is not real.

I'm sure they would have learned a lot in the past eight or so years? Is it harder to fool them now compared to in the past?
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tazmanian
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:35 am Reply with quoteBack to top

There's just so many of them. I remember Shiver once saying he estimated we had about 100 scammers for each baiter. Also, I don't think most lads are very smart and even if they are wising up, I like to think the baiters are getting better, too Smile

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Namwan
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Don't the scammers warn their fellow scammers about what to avoid?
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CryHavoc
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Joined: 28 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 4:07 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Why would they?
If they work in a gang probably. However they likely feel shame, embarrasment etc at being fooled into doing whatever that if they can avoid doing so they probably will.
Also there's so many of them so spread out that even if they do warn their immediate brudas there's still plenty more they won't tell.
And some don't seem to understand why we would do this to them for no money in the first place.
Just my thoughts.

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Bort
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:32 am Reply with quoteBack to top

While I'm sure many baited scammers have learnt from their mistakes (well, except for perpetual victims-for-life like Shorty Laughing), there are always vast amounts of new, green lads that are unaware of the dangers lurking within the sea of potential victims.

Baiting doesn't seem to be something most scammers especially understand - even those familiar with the "Gmail Jokers" rarely seem to grasp the motivation behind baiting or the sorts of tactics we use (most lads who have twigged on me have tended to assume I'm a rival scammer rather than a baiter). I doubt those lads that have been baited heavily would share their experiences with other lads either - it would be an embarrassing thing to admit, I'd think.

There are also a whole lot of baiters using many different modalities. Obvious trophy baiters and those sending blatantly ridiculous emails may be sussed out, but then you have very skilled straight baiters who are indistinguishable from real victims.

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Namwan
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:43 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Thanks. Can you point out some examples of straight baiting? The ones I've read in the letters archive are all trophies.
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Bort
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:51 am Reply with quoteBack to top

The best straight baits generally don't make for the best reads, as they're about stringing along scammers for an agonizingly long time by playing a very believable victim (albeit one who always somehow fails to pay).

I'd recommend reading this Eater University tutorial on straight baiting. It's one of the most useful baiting articles I've ever read, and much of its content can applied to all forms of baiting, not just straight baiting. Smile

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Namwan
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Thank you!
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4X1X9
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:02 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I think to some extent scammers are harder to fool now than they were back in 2006 when I started. When I started baiting, for example, I didn't take or make phone calls, these days it is almost a necessity if you want a bait to last more than a week.

However, scammers can still be fooled because, in the end, just as they sometimes try to play on a victims greed (NOTE: I am not implying all victims are greedy) to get them to do something they normally wouldn't we can appeal to their greed to do things that they wouldn't do under normal circumstances.

It isn't beyond the realms of possibility that scammers sell Email addys of baiters (or jokers as they call us because they really don't understand baiting) to rivals under the pretence that they are a good mugu. If you think about it this would work in their favour as it would slow their competition down.

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Agent1002
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:12 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I straight bait lads that are obviously no where they say are and not who they claim to be.

An example of mine was a lad in Haiti, a victim of the earthquake, not really.

My church for real was raising $50K. I took photos of the fund raising chart.

Then we sent it to a mission there.. There is an envelope in the shipment with his name on it. Just drop by the mission and pick it up in person.. Cool

The red Cross in England is accepting donations.. by Western Union. Happy to oblige.. Sent a teller's check for the receipt for tax records.. to the real Red Cross address.. Rolling Eyes

Bankers at verifiable real banks get the same treatment. The test answer is $500,000.00 US. I faxed the MTCN and other account details directly to you at the bank. Don't worry, nobody at the bank can steal it as only you have the test answer.

When he claims the fax is broken.. he will. tell him to call you from your extension at the bank.. Razz Most lads don't have the resources to spoof caller ID. If they manage that, claim the receipt is at home, in the car, at work etc and offer to call back directly to the bank's published number.

Massive lad torment on that one. You sent the money... but.. we have a problem.. Laughing

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YKnott
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Joined: 04 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:29 am Reply with quoteBack to top

This is something I've been thinking about recently.

I stopped baiting in 2008, & came back to it this year, and several changes have struck me.

Many Lads have sped things up noticeably - (using scripts that are slightly better written, and that get to the payout faster), They're also keen to use 'chat' sessions & phonecalls to (both speed up the process, and possibly to try & sift out baiters too ?). They're also more persistent in trying to get photos (for the same reasons).
Vlads, although working to the same basic formula as ever, have also sped things up & improved their scripts. Quite often now, they'll go for the 'need money for translation' line after only 2 or 3 mails. They also are more persistent in wanting phonecalls, 'chat', & photos. Again, I think this is partly to get to the payout faster, partly to try & weed out the baiters.

The good old - fashioned dumb as a pile of pricks scammer is still out there in big numbers, but my gut feeling is they're more of a minority now.


(or maybe I've just got thicker ?!)

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Rowan
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I don't know about smarter, but they're impatient as hell and lazy as a result. They don't want put in the effort. I've been reading up on 419 scams because I'm one of those strange individuals who actually enjoys research. From what I've found, more West African young men are joining the ranks. The economies over there aren't doing so well--Nigeria alone has a 70% poverty rate--and it's a sure-fire way to make loads of money. Plus, some villages venerate lads who bring home tons of cash, and are able to buy houses, cars and support their families in style.

I theorize with many young men getting involved in scamming, the competition for victims is fierce. Most people ignore scam letters or the emails land in their spam folders where they aren't ever seen. It's a precious few who actually respond and are willing to send lads money. If you're fishing in a tiny pond with hundreds of your closest buddies, you're going to be quick to throw out that old boot you caught, rebait your hook and hope for a fish. I get lads who are not willing to invest the time in the scam. They ask for money the second email they send out and send me lad rage on the third when I don't exactly follow their expectations. They're gone within a week because I didn't immediately run out to Western Union when they told me to. They don't have time for me; they have to go get a compliant victim before some other scammer gets his hooks in that victim. Some, of course, can sniff out a baiter and twig because they know they're not going to get anywhere.

There are others who are willing to go along with my old lady character, gain her trust, talk with her instead of sending business-like script after script. I have several on the hook for the two months I've been baiting, still hopeful I'm going to throw some money their way. I think they're more confident in their skills as scammers than the impatient, temperamental lads. They know if they can emotionally hook the victim, the payout will just keep coming. The victim will pay for every needed document, every bribe, etc. I don't think those who seem to want to rake in as much money as fast as possible don't understand that.

But like I've said, that's just my theory on what I've learned out there researching. Smile

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JoWhite
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 1:23 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Well, I've got one now who writes perfect English. What gives him or her away, is that the word 'okay' appears behind just a tad too many sentences. Other than that, the lad uses words that others won't even know about. I would not mind, by the way, if others would also start a bait with him/her. I'm a filthy rich lesbian by the way in this case. She wants me to pay to get a few boxes of money, but my lawyer keeps offering to just fly there with my jet to pick them up and avoid charges.
If you want her e-mail addy, just send me a PM and I'll give it to you, along with the initial scam letter.

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