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 How far is too far legally?

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Canadon Alfa
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 293


PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 6:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I'm not sure I agree with the rule, never work harder than your lad does. Certainly the main ideal is to waste their time. However, one of the great pleasures of scambaiting is to build an imaginary scenario and then sell it to your lad. Sometimes--not all the time, but sometimes--it's worth taking a few extra steps to make sure the scenario you create is believable, detailed and convincing.

When I've used fake churches in baits, I have on occasion created fake "manifestos" for the churches, expounding their philosophy and beliefs. I've also spent a good many hours setting up elaborate networks of websites and ghost phones, just on the off chance that a lad decides to try calling a "general information" number that appears in something I've sent him, or what have you. I've also created fake websites for organizations that my baiting characters supposedly belong to just on the off chance that a lad goes looking for them. It will probably never happen, but if I happen to get a smart lad that wants to investigate, I want him to conclude "there's no way this could be fake, because no one would spend the time and effort to fake this website, so it must be real."

To me, scambaiting is all about planting thoughts in your lad's head. Get him to accept a few basic (fake) facts, and you can build from there into a total fantasy world that they will never question because they're too emotionally and financially invested in getting a payoff to even conceive of a scenario being fake. This is how some of the great baiters on this site, like YeaWhatever, lure scammers to such extremes--because their fantasy worlds are total and convincing. Maybe it takes me 20 minutes to knock together a fake website. Fine. I'd rather have the reassurance of knowing the website is there, even if the lad never visits it, than have a bait crater because a lad has a sneaking suspicion that you're putting him on.

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Andy419
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Joined: 01 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:58 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I agree completely, if you don't put in any time into your baits so you can have some kind of moral victory then what's the point? Look at Shiver's baits, he obviously puts effort in and you can see the results.
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Nailgunner
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:14 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

^ agreed, you shouldn't work harder overall than your lad does.

Nothing wrong with putting in a few evenings work on the computer setting up a fake trail of information for him to find if it later results in him travelling 500 miles across country, starving half to death in a foreign country and being abandoned by his oga after someone cancels his airline ticket home. Then he will restore the balance of effort very quickly.

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BearSeason
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Joined: 19 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:31 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I think it's about finding the right balance. Does your lad really need to see a website or would an e-mail telling him about your fake church/organization/store/whatever modality be enough to convince him? Sure, some lads are smart and would probably want to see visual evidence. And there are baiters who are quite handy with html and can set up a website in about 10 minutes. But your baiting should never interfere with your real life, especially when your lad doesn't even need all that extra work to be convinced.

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Simon Bar Sinister
419Eater is my life


Joined: 25 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 3:51 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Andy419 wrote:
ParaNoid wrote:
You could just list something for sale on Craigslist or Gum Tree. Scammers hit on anything there.

We have another rule: Don't work harder than your lad does.

Use your mind. They are not looking for Real items to buy. They only pretend to have interest in a transaction in most cases.

Try some straight baiting and see what you can learn from that. THEN after your feet are wet, start thinking about web sites. You don't want to be a fantasy baiter... Shocked


Web development is what I'm most passionate about, I don't really mind if I spend more time than a scammer developing a website, which is something I do all the time anyway. Besides, my plan is to make the tools which I'll develop for myself available for use by other baiters so they can add another tool to their repertoire in their fight against advance fee fraud.

I've straight baited before. The main reason I'm developing my own scam baiting specific email provider is because gmail kept suspending my baiting accounts for "suspected fraud" Shocked All I was doing was straight baiting then too. Confused

So yeah I appreciate your advice but respectfully disagree Wink


The develop a baiting tool that will drive the lads nuts without violating the law. A new Security Cod3 Generator, Look at the old Scr00g3 McDuck threads that had the S3cur3 Money Transfer Modality.. Make em answer a billion questions to generate the code and issue em a fake one..

Cash B4iting is bad form.. it puts us on their level.. Hence we avoid it.

But you seem to have greatness written all over you... now how much evil can you come up with??

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