Family ITP ethics (split from Tattooed Lad goes from Lagos t

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Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 5:19 pm

not handicapped by any knowledge as I didn't read too much of the stuff above.

If family has knowledge of the crime they are part of it and thus guilty
If they have no knowledge they are victims.
How you are going to tell the difference from this end of the www is not simple.

Daddy plays all day on a computer and then runs to the WU office twice a day and I have no clue what he is doing?
I am three/four years old then Laughing

The rest has good knowledge about how daddy makes his money, if they want to help or not it, is still conspiracy if they don't report him to the local law.

Same reason for the Wu offices around the world, but that's how they make their money and then we like to call that business, just like daddy Rolling Eyes

Remember it's a USofA company Exclamation

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:19 pm

bill2, I would suggest that you read the following very carefully. Additionally, your comment that this somehow has to do with the fact that WU is US based, is as idiotic as it is inflammatory.

Quote:

***WESTERN UNION IS A SERVICE THAT SCAMMERS ABUSE.***

WU is a legitimate service that is abused by scammers. Other services that the scammers abuse include, but are not limited to; MoneyGram, TDD/TTY services, the US/UK postal service et al, UPS, Fed Ex, DHL and every single free webmail provider past, present and future.

Western Union is a business, like all businesses, their goal is to make a profit, not to make decisions for their customers or get involved in every aspect of their customers personal affairs. They are aware that the scammers use their service and have even taken the initiative to provide warnings on their website. To my knowledge they are under no legal obligation to do so.

I have gone through the effort to provide some links and PDFs from Western Union's website that clearly addresses specific scams and specific types of scams and even what one should do if they suspect that they may be involved in a scam. I would highly suggest that you read them very thoroughly before making another libelous public post about a very large corporation which you very obviously know nothing about other than what you have read, were told, or have heard, from other equally uninformed sources.

http://www.westernunion.com/info/fraudIndex.asp?country=global
http://www.westernunion.com/info/fraudProtectYourself.asp?country=global
http://www.westernunion.com/info/fraudProtectYourPassword.asp?country=global
http://www.westernunion.com/info/fraudScams.asp?country=global
http://www.westernunion.com/info/fraudTips.asp?country=global

http://members.419eater.com/~jose_cuervo/western_union/wu_pdf1.pdf
http://members.419eater.com/~jose_cuervo/western_union/wu_pdf2.pdf
http://members.419eater.com/~jose_cuervo/western_union/wu_pdf3.pdf

If you have any evidence of Western Union or its employees' direct involvement in advance fee fraud, you may post it here to support previous statements. Failing that, please either submit it to the proper authorities in the appropriate jurisdictions (IE Law Enforcement) or write a letter to Western Union's complaint department, corporate headquarters, sponsors etc, but do not make unsupportable claims of fraud on this forum based upon opinions and conjecture.

Stick to the topic.

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:12 pm

Popiejopie wrote:

Ah, but what if - theoretically - a lad goes on his safari and brings his wife, kid, brother, uncle? (Not likely, but imagine the situation). Who would drop the lad, who would carry on with the bait ?

When lad does something unexpected like bringing his family it's his fault.
When your lad shoots his wife in the head, its not your fault, you didnt tell him to do such thing.

Different thing is when you tell him to bring family and close relatives blah blah blah... It's not good. We're targeting scammers, not their uncles, brothers and wifes. Unless you have proof his wife is actively participating in the scam. I personally would feel bad sending wife and kids for safari.

One thing I have to agree with black dog. I think scammer's kids are new generation of scammers. But we dont know that, so it's not our problem. Once they become scammers, they free to bait.

Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:30 pm

It was said, quite well in fact, a few pages ago that when the spammers start considering the families of those they scam, then we should consider their families as well.

I couldnt agree more.

Anyone who thinks that the families, except perhaps for the kids, don't know how the lad makes his money is only fooling themselves.
I'm happy to use ethics in my baits and in fact do so and would never knowingly have a lad take their kids with them on a safari.

However if Laddies wants to bring the wife, mom, dad, etc it would only sweeten the end result.

Awesome bait BlackDog.....keep up the exceptional work! Very Happy

Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 11:28 pm

I really don't think we should make any assumptions about what a lad's wife, wives, kids, or other family know or do not know. To assume that they "must" know what he's doing is quite a stretch. Lots of spouses only know that the person "works in an office," or "for a company." I've been married 17 years, and my wife really has no idea what I do for a living. I sit in a home office in front of a computer all day, go on business trips now and then (sure, call them safaris!), and have unidentified visitors once or twice a year, but she's not interested at all in the content of what I work on. I could easily be a scammer and she wouldn't know, nor would my 12-year old kids. (My clients' courtroom opponents probably do think I'm a scammer, actually.)

It's also risky to assume the family doesn't know. We really don't have any idea, and we shouldn't base our behavior on any assumption when we are so lacking in knowledge. I think SOOI was right to try to warn that lad's wife, but if she didn't want to believe him, it's really not our problem any more.

I always assume the lad's family is innocent. Even if the kids know their dad is a crook and he's got them participating in some way, they are always innocent anyway, unless we're talking full-grown and responsible adults.

419Eater is my life Joined: 22 Jan 2010 Posts: 329

Think of it like this: if the police think someone committed a crime, they arrest him. They don't arrest his wife unless they have evidence that she was also involved. Marrying a criminal isn't a crime. Same deal for us.

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