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 Split from Radio show thread: Ethics of the Chad Bait

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FrumpyBB
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
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Location: Germany


PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:09 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Great Very Happy , but I would not want to aggravate you on purpose. Do you really need to hear the "greedy-stupid"-sentence again?? beating puke I´m glad this is over (for this week); but it´s still full moon, so I expect the worst.

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Ralph Wiggum
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:11 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I received this PM. Since he complained he couldn't post here, I would like to bring his argument to light.

Quote:
So I'll address your question here. You made the decision to rent to a person, from another country, without doing any form of credit or background check. You decided to take a money order. You decided to refund the money, before the money order had cleared the bank. You made these errors. This is not the same thing as a random gang attacking a person, it simply isn't. Now, if that person was attacked less randomly, say walking alone, after dark, in an economically depressed, high crime area while dressed in expensive clothing, then that person made several errors in judgment. That does not mean that person "deserved" to be mugged, and you did not "deserve" to be scammed. You just made errors. All these people in this forum who will coddle you will simply not tell you the plain truth... getting into a business arrangement with someone you don't know, and whom you don't do a credit check on, is foolish, plain and simple.


My response will be here as well.

You are waffling, my friend. There is no point in continuing to argue. I need to go spend time scamming the foolish (exponentially, of course) in order to fill the void left by my own foolishness.. I am a shallow and vengeful misanthropist so..........


Toodles! Very Happy

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Slightlyoutofit
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:22 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

YeaWhatever wrote:
hash conditions.


I thought you were a heroin addict? Hash is pussy to a hardcore user like you.

On the subject of a lad dying on a bait.
My personal view of the lads is to feel nothing about them. I don't see them as people. I try not to hate them (not always successfully) but look upon them the same way as I would an insect. Sounds callous, but after seeing the shit they get up to, it's simple to extricate them from humanity. That's not my failing, it's theirs.

For this reason I couldn't care less if a lad died on a bait either by my hand or by another baiter's. Have I gone out of my way to get one killed? No. Has a bait naturally gravitated to where a lad might get killed? Yes, plenty of times. Did I push it from there? Yes. How would I have felt if he had got killed? I would have felt nothing. Maybe a slight feeling of grim satisfaction that the bait worked out as I hoped it to, but for the lad himself? Nothing.

But this is irrelevant. There's never been a single case where a baiter has got a lad killed. On the other hand, there have been plenty of cases where scammers have either personally killled or indirectly killed their victims.

A baiter getting a lad killed is a total hypothetical. If you're a baiter and you come across the scenario where a lad is in danger, no-one is forcing you to push him further if you don't want to. If you do want to, you'll certainly end up disappointed, but if by a miracle you do succeed, then make sure you've planned ahead on how to deal with it. I've made my peace. If it happens, it happens (although if there are any certainties in this life there's a certainty that this will never occur, however hard I go for it) and I know 100% that I'll sleep at night. In the meantime, I'll keep pushing.

Maybe one day it will happen. When it does, I won't give a shit.

@Ralph. Fuck him. He's had the reading material sent to him. If he can't be bothered to learn before spouting off, he's not worth any more time.

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Dutch
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:46 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Ow dear .. McPrick has left the building? Laughing

I'm jealous of the energy you guys have to keep addressing this idiots arguments. The troll really should have had a look in the General chat section to get an idea of the people hanging around here. But then again you really can't expect a troll to do that ...

Can I put forward a special *banned* custom tag for this piece of shite, since he keeps harassing members through PM? Good riddens I'd say.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Ralph - when someone is suspended, they can't post. So please don't do it. We offered him a voice to make his objections. He/she refused to read what had been posted. Which means; 1) Wants to feel important by objecting to everything. 2) Is objecting to everything for the sake of objecting 3) Will never ever be able to see this from the victims point of view 4) Is now just laughing at us waste our time defending a position we already know to be justified.

It's a sad little circle, but we just ride it out.

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Ralph Wiggum
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:51 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Roger. Sorry. Wink

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doc holliday
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:34 am Reply with quoteBack to top

@Titania-you take it as far as you are comfortable with.No one here want's you to do more.We all have our personal styles and preferences.The object is to waste the lads time.There are some things that I have personal problems with,so I don't persue them.It doen't mean we can't find them funny if someone else does it.All here agree the lads deserve what they get.There is no one right way of baiting them.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I think my signature kind of sums up how I feel about it. Wink

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Frozboz
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Can I post what I (and others) really think about this guy? I'll take a suspension/ban just to get this thread locked. I'm ALL about taking a bullet for the team.

That, and I'm a little drunk to boot.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Step away from the bottle, Froz. Laughing The troll is not able to post anymore.

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Frozboz
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

lotta wrote:
Step away from the bottle, Froz. Laughing


Never! Twisted Evil

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Albator
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:57 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I'm wondering what the troll is thinking right now?
Is he reading what was proposed?
Maybe he's eating is keyboard with frustration while no more being able to post his bullshit? And we continue to talk about him?
Really I'm wondering...

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Professor So And So
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:49 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Out of the couple e-mails that we received from TAL listeners that disagreed with our bait, I chose this one to respond to. I did my best to address every point that she raised, and I felt like it would be worth posting here as well. I think she had a well thought out e-mail, and I hope I did at least a mediocre job at responding to everything. I added a bold/italic on her words. The exchange is as follows:


Quote:

Hello Amy,

Thanks again for the e-mail, and please let me know if you have any more questions after this. Also, I'll probably post this exchange on the boards, as it might help some other readers with some questions they might have.


I'm a regular listener of This American Life, but rarely do I become as intrigued by a story as I did this past week. I've certainly never written to anyone that was featured in one. But, after having read through the whole "bait" thread on the 419eater website, I thought I'd go ahead and say/ask some things that have been on my mind. I was going to post on the forum, but since the relevant ethics thread seemed to quickly break down, I thought I'd go with a direct mail.



We really appreciate you taking the time to express yourself, and let us know what you think. Also, it's nice to have the opportunity to answer some questions, and give you a better view on how we (the group I bait with, and I feel I can speak for them here) see things. The fact that you listen to TAL regularly, and this is the first time you have contacted one of the subjects, is hopefully going to help you understand the overall effect that a bait of this nature has when people listen to the radio program, or take the time to read it at 419Eater.com.


Frankly, I was pretty horrified by what I heard and read. I certainly think scamming people is terrible. I certainly don't think the victims of such scams deserve to be victimized. But, I can't see how torturing someone like Adamu is going to help anyone. It's pretty clear that he's not the sharpest tool in any shed and, while I am sure that some scammers do make a lot of money from their schemes, I can't see that Adamu ever has or ever will. You may have taken up a lot of his time, and thus kept him from attempting to victimize others, but in the process led him to create multiple unwitting victims ("the Hand" for example, who, as far as I can tell, is just a guy trying to make an honest living in a desperately poor country). Miracle and Andrew are an even more extreme example. One of you says in the forum that you think they actually would join the church (if it were real) and I think several things they say in their e-mails bear this out. In other words, you are taking up the time of two people who aren't intending to rob the fictional church and who want to leave scamming behind and, again, encouraging them to create new victims, such as their own unpaid driver.



Adamu, by himself, would probably not be the best scammer in the world, you're right about that. However, I'm not sure if you're aware that a lot of these scammers work in groups. We have confirmation that the particular group that they worked with was EXTREMELY successful in what they were doing (by scammer standards). In the weeks that followed their arrival to Chad, they got increasingly desperate, and started to do some pretty stupid things that they might not otherwise do if they were in the safety of their normal haunt in Lagos. One of the fatal mistakes they made for their particular organization, was to expose the e-mail addresses of the people they worked for in Lagos. While we effectively took over the communication between the scammers, we used various baiting accounts to gather more and more information on these guys, and other scammers that worked in their group. We then took all of the personal information we had gathered, and passed it along to a group that focuses specifically on victim warning. That group of volunteers has MANY connections (people working alongside of the scammers as informants) in that area, and with enough personal information on the actual scammers, can actually get lists of e-mail addresses of actual real life victims that are in the process of being scammed, or close to sending money.

All of these victims were immediately warned by that organization, and the scammers are still being monitored with the help of informants close (proximity) to them. Within the first couple of weeks after they had gotten the information they needed from us, they told us that that information had already saved around $20k in payments to this group. This was confirmed by victim responses to the warnings, many of whom were very close to sending the money.

What's important to see here, is that there is much more to the picture than simply the act of sending some morons into Chad. Sure, alone they might not be too effective, but then again, not many would, and that's why they choose to work in groups.

Also, with safari baiting, the involvement of third parties, on some level, is inevitable. Unfortunately, there is rarely a way around at least minor contact. I do not believe that they got out of Chad without eventually settling with their driver. Also, in a recent bait we had going on Adamu, when it got to the payment stage, he asked us to send the money to Hamza the cow seller. He's apparently going to settle whatever debt he has with him (but we'll still do our best to insure it won't be with money from scamming).


You mention several times in various responses that Adamu always had a choice, that he could have gone back to Nigeria at any time but stayed because he was "greedy," yet when Adamu tried to get money from home in order to go back, you tricked him into not communicating with the people who actually could have gotten him home (ND and CZ). How much choice did that leave him?


Yes, you're right. At that point, it was a little too late for him to just up and get out of Chad, but remember, that's what we wanted to begin with. When we said that he always had the choice whether to go forward or not, in no way did we intend to imply that we weren't going to do everything in our power to push him in that direction. As I said in the interview, our goal was to get him as far away from home as possible, and keep him there as long as we could.



I also wonder about the definition of "greed' when applied to someone as poor as Adamu likely is. This leads me to another question -- have any of you ever spent time in a third world country (not including package tours that don't leave the beach)? Do you have any idea of the type of desperation living in such a place can lead to? Yes, poverty does not justify crime, but there is something a bit sickening about hearing wealthy first world people mocking West Africans. While there are several posts in which you, or others on the forum, mention the dire living conditions in Chad as a means to cause suffering for Adamu or other lads, I can't see where you ever really consider what those conditions mean. At one point, in the bait thread (I can't find it right now) one of you even says that you don't understand what makes someone (in reference to Miracle and Andrew) go so far away to such a dangerous place with so little persuading, but it's pretty easy for me to see the cause -- sheer desperation and hope of attaining a lifestyle even one tenth as luxurious as those most of us live here. (By the way, I'm a graduate student -- so I'm not wealthy by American standards, I've just travelled enough to know that by world standards I might as well be Donald Trump).



During the course of a bait like this, there is an astonishing amount of research that actually goes into the areas. In fact, it's one of the best parts about safari baiting, in my opinion. We got to learn so much about Chad, that I really feel like I know more about it than some countries in Europe. As you said though, it does take first-hand experience to really get to know a place like that. I have never been to that area of the world.

Something that did happen though, was that during the course of the bait, when the lads had been stuck in Abeche already for some time, we contacted the cyber cafe owner in Abeche (yes, Hospital Road). We were extremely polite, and asked if he would mind telling us a bit about the area. He was more than happy to answer any of our questions, and thought it was super cool to be talking with some Americans through e-mail. It gave him some practice speaking English, he said (I believe he spoke 4 other languages as well). This man grew up IN Abeche. He finished school there, went off to college on loan, and then chose to move BACK to Abeche. There, he started the only cyber cafe in the city, and quite frankly, was one of the nicest guys we have ever met. Do I think he was scamming? No. Did he spend his entire upbringing in Chad? Yep. The obvious difference is that he applied himself to creating a better life for himself, which consequently led him to help create a better life for his community by being able to have the know-how to bring the internet to Abeche, and digitally link that city to the rest of the world.

We were so impressed by this guy, we decided to send him a digital camera. He got it about a month after it was sent.


I also wonder what you think the punishment for scamming should be? On multiple occassions there are gleeful references to Adamu's possible death. On the website detailing "the Road to Chad/Darfur" it appears that two men involved in that bait were never heard from again. Despite the blithe comparison one of you made between Abeche and New York City, I am sure that you are educated enough to realize that there is no similarity between one of the richest cities in the world and a civil war wracked chaotic desert, in terms of danger or anything else. So I ask, should attempted robbery merit the death penalty? Or, if so, should it always? Even for wealthy westerners? Frankly I wouldn't have minded seeing those Enron guys on the next plane to Abeche.



Yes, it's true that the two scammers that went into Darfur during the bait you mentioned were never heard from again. When I made the reference to New York City during that interview, it was over the course of a larger conversation. Editing is a VERY important part of how a story gets told. I guess how I can best sum up my feelings about that situation is to say I felt no concern for them. The United nations estimated (Dec 2007) that there were 212,000 refugees living in camps in the Abeche region of Chad. THOSE people did not necessarily CHOOSE to go into a known war-zone, chasing after $200,000 from a church that deals with humanitarian aid. Frankly, I do feel a lot of emotion when I see the living conditions in this region, but I certainly don't feel emotional when some scammer decides to up and run face-first into that area in an attempt to steal money that otherwise would be used to feed the hungry mouths already there. That, to me, is seriously horrendous behavior, and exposes the very soul of these filthy scumbags.

Do I think robbery merits the death penalty? No. Do I think getting stuck living in the same conditions that the people you were trying to steal from for over 100 days is poetic justice? Definitely. And yeah, I too would love to see some of those Enron bastards rotting away in the same situation that they put so many people into. That also would be some damn fine justice.


Which leads me to my final question/comment: have you ever tried baiting someone on roughly the same level as you are? By that I mean, clearly you have resources of which Adamu could never even conceive. Pushing him around seems ridiculously easy. Don't get me wrong, I certaintly couldn't pull it off and I can tell that it took a great deal of creativity and effort, but when the playing field is so slanted to one side, it seems cruel and, yes, sadistic, in a way that it wouldn't if you were fighting someone your own size so to speak. Someone who had the same advantages that we've likely all had, but chose, out of all the possibilities, to con people.


Jojobean and I spent some time at the beginning of the year ONLY focused on baiting European scammers. One of the odd things that I got to find out, is that many of these scammers are better educated, live in far nicer areas, and have greater resource. Another interesting thing was that every one we came into contact with was West African. We ended up sending a couple of them to different countries, and it was fun. They're way harder to move around, but it's not too easy to keep them there for all that long. Another thing to add is that if we had sent the Lagos scammers to say, Cameroon instead if Chad, it would have been MUCH easier for them to get back. We chose Chad specifically because it would be very difficult for them to get out of there with no money. If they were somewhere in Europe, it's entirely more simple to get help.


In Closing, this particular bait has shed a lot of light on 419 scams in general, and has no doubt raised public awareness. I know for certain that countless new baiters have joined the cause after reading it, and now even more after hearing the radio show. Something to keep in mind here, is that the style that jojobean, YW, and myself choose to bait in, is not a common form of baiting. It's hard to say, when you factor in all of the new baiting activity that will take place because of that bait, the REAL effect it will have on the scammer community. So, you can choose to look at this in a way that you see the minimal picture, and just some time wasted for two scammers in Chad, or you can look at the larger picture. The larger picture is that because of that trip, every hour of ANY scammer's time that is now wasted as a result of people reading/hearing about those two "poor scammers" that followed their thieving hearts to Chad, is an indirect consequence of that bait. Some of these new baiters will take to safaris, and some will straight bait. Some might just focus on lotto lads, and some might get into site-killing. Some might focus on romance scams, or strictly seek out Craiglist scammers. The one thing we do know, is that in reality, there is a much larger fight happening than there was with the two nitwits in Chad, and the publication of their stupidity, as painful as it might look to you, has certainly increased the numbers on our side.

Thanks for you're time,

~PhD

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Simba
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:29 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Nice response Prof.... Thumbs up

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Safari=Mr Danka-Dakar to Bangul-SSC Gambia
Safari=Mr Twumasi-Accra to Cotonou-SSC Benin
Safari=Mr Gomer-Lagos to Douala to Parakou-SSC Cameroon & SSC Benin
SafariSafariSafari=Mr Chukwu-Lome to Accra to Koforidua. Lome to Lagos. Lome to Cotonou.

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streaded
Master Baiter


Joined: 01 Aug 2008
Posts: 147
Location: Streded in hash conditions


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:30 am Reply with quoteBack to top

after the earlier troll has now gone it is nice to see that you do get some who disagree with you and are willing to give them a voice here even when they dont put it here themselves.
I do agree with most things in baiting and in the UK the law has gone to far to protect the criminal in most cases ( and now you may even get arrested here if you use harsh language against a gang of thugs attacking you ).
I had to laugh when a news report of a car thief who tried to hot wire a car and caused it to burst into flames killing him about a year or two ago.

A question for the team if you dont mind:

what percentages are there of praise / new members to critisizm concerning this bait and radio show ( my personal guess would be at least 90% praise to 10% against in some way but would be interested in the opinions of those involved

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Professor So And So
Elite Baiter


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 1337
Location: Hash Conditions


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:45 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Maybe 97% praise to 3% against. I haven't actually divided everything, but that's my take, just shooting from the hip.

_________________
Safari - Ibrahim - Lagos - Parakou - "Find out if there is any western union money transfer from the 5imba camp"
Safari - Mr. Green - Germany - Amsterdam, Holland - "I'll be in a brown check suit and trousers and a brown shoe."
Safari - Mr. Mark - Accra - Tamale - "I thank you so much for the pain,time,money and life that you caused."
Safari - Mr. Neill - London, England - Glasgow, Scotland - "Yu are really causing confusions between us all."
Safari - William - Accra, Ghana - Maiduguri, Nigeria
Safari - Miracle - Benin - N'Djamena, Chad - "Too much mosquitoes"
Safari - Godspower - Ghana - N'Djamena, Chad
Golden Pith - Adamu - Lagos, Nigeria - Abeche, Chad (100 days in hell) - Shocked - "SAVE ME"
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Albator
Elite Baiter


Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Posts: 1036
Location: Belgium


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

^^^^

I think such percentages would be difficult to guess.
Simply because only the most interested decided to join.
There are probably people that found it fun but will never join or bait.
And probably more who disliked it but will never tell a word, simply go to something else.

The troll that was here is a particular case of someone so pissed by the story he had to join to bullshit as much as possible...

Just my $0.02

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Simba
master of subtlety


Joined: 19 Nov 2006
Posts: 4092
Location: Bila Shaka


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

To be honest I have been waiting for a backlash from "horrified" listeners complaining about the unfair treatment of Adamu, and the baying mob mentality of Eaters.

But it simply hasn't materialised.

Even McDirty didn't have a genuine complaint, he was just a WUM and would have trolled regardless.

You can never please all the people, all the time.
There is always going to be someone upset or offended, but I'd say that the vast majority of people are right behind us as scambaiters, and thoroughly enjoyed the Chad safari.......

So bloody well done all to all involved...... clapping

_________________
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Safari=King Zongo-Ouaga to Accra to Lome to Accra to Lome
Safari=Mr Duru-Ouaga to Accra to Ouaga to Abidjan
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Safari=Mr Jiullus-Abidjan to Accra to Kumasi to Tamale
Safari=Mr Dandy-Abidjan to Monrovia-SSC Liberia
Safari=Mr Mandela-Jo'burg to Maun-SSC Botswana
Safari=Mr Danka-Dakar to Bangul-SSC Gambia
Safari=Mr Twumasi-Accra to Cotonou-SSC Benin
Safari=Mr Gomer-Lagos to Douala to Parakou-SSC Cameroon & SSC Benin
SafariSafariSafari=Mr Chukwu-Lome to Accra to Koforidua. Lome to Lagos. Lome to Cotonou.

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Professor So And So
Elite Baiter


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 1337
Location: Hash Conditions


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:08 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Thanks, Simba. It definitely means something to know you're not against what we do. Wink


Quote:
I think such percentages would be difficult to guess.
Simply because only the most interested decided to join.


I thought Stredded was asking specifically the ratio of the positive/negative responses we received to the dedicated e-mail we set up for listeners. That was the rough figure I quoted. I didn't even consider for a moment what the numbers might be if I took in the hypotheticals. I was just too lazy to do all the math from the e-mail account.

The reason I took the time to go through the one I posted here, point by point, was that I felt she did a perfect job at expressing her thoughts/concerns in a respectful manner. I didn't feel that she was trying to state something with her questions. It seemed like genuine interest. I hope it shed some more light on why we do what we do.

_________________
Safari - Ibrahim - Lagos - Parakou - "Find out if there is any western union money transfer from the 5imba camp"
Safari - Mr. Green - Germany - Amsterdam, Holland - "I'll be in a brown check suit and trousers and a brown shoe."
Safari - Mr. Mark - Accra - Tamale - "I thank you so much for the pain,time,money and life that you caused."
Safari - Mr. Neill - London, England - Glasgow, Scotland - "Yu are really causing confusions between us all."
Safari - William - Accra, Ghana - Maiduguri, Nigeria
Safari - Miracle - Benin - N'Djamena, Chad - "Too much mosquitoes"
Safari - Godspower - Ghana - N'Djamena, Chad
Golden Pith - Adamu - Lagos, Nigeria - Abeche, Chad (100 days in hell) - Shocked - "SAVE ME"
pony pony Pretty Rose Suitcase Mortar 17
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streaded
Master Baiter


Joined: 01 Aug 2008
Posts: 147
Location: Streded in hash conditions


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I was only thinking of a guess, it was quite obvious during the bait that a lot of people joined because of it ( like me ) and lots more since.
I thought with the radio show it would be more like 75 / 25 and loads of abuse on here, I do not know about messages sent privately, to people here or at the radio station or anywhere else but guess you people involved would know a bit more and am very happy that it sounds like it is better than my guess from the outside without knowing how much hate mail and death threats anyone had got Wink
90 / 10 I think is very good for scambaiting and 97 / 3 is absolutly amazing.
well done everyone, you a$$holes are my hero's

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U. Sir Name
Not quite a Newb


Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 76
Location: In My Own Face


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Sorry I got into this thread so late, but I felt compelled to add my two cents worth before it gets locked.

Quote:
We all have different motives, in different degrees.


Absolutely correct. I have zero interest in getting trophies or sending lads on safari anywhere. To be perfectly honest, I'm just not that ambitious. But if I can get a lad off script and manage to waste 5-10 minutes of his day dealing with my nonsense, then hooray for me.However far anyone else chooses to take a bait is at their own discretion. One thing you have to remember, is that WE do not initiate contact with these scammers. THEY choose to send out their bullshit scam e-mails. In this case, Adamu sent an e-mail to the wrong person, and he deserved every bit of what he got for doing so. It could have ended any time Adamu wanted it to. He chose to keep going.

Quote:
You think there's something inherient and exclusive to Nigeria that causes only Nigerians to be con artists?


Only Nigerian? No. But a fairly significant number. I wouldn't go so far as to say that Nigerians are genetically predisposed to scamming, but go take a look at the "I Go Chop Your Dolla" video, and how popular it is in Nigeria, then you tell me that scamming isn't a huge part of the culture. I have been a member of the boards here for less than 3 months now, and have only 1 catcher account. In that time, I have received well over 1000 of these scam e-mails. Sadly, for a good number of Nigerians, "going to work" means coming up with some new way to go about ripping people off. The thing that particularly pisses me off about these lads is that the way they go about trying to rip people off... By playing off the sympathy off others. I'm a poor young girl whose parents were murdered. Help me. I'm a dying christian widow wanting to donate my millions to charity. Help me. I run a orphanage and motherless babies home. Help me. The list goes on and on. I would have more respect for, and be more inclined to help someone who sent me an e-mail just asking me for help because times are hard. I can relate to that. But no. I get an e-mail that's obviously bullshit, from some F*ckstick whose ambitions in life amount to separating me from my money, and then going and singing "I Go Chop Your Dolla". Game On. Twisted Evil

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I understand your concern,if this process is legal or not.Right all i have to tell you is that this process is illegal - Paul Lockett

Please take note my name is DAKORU BAKARE and not Bukake

i got your ATM card and you come and bring your information and also pay your $95 charge and collect the God dam card ok.

ok sorry i got you message, and i going to go fuck myself as you said. thanks very much.
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Corona
Eater's sweetheart


Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 8609
Location: On ya left!


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:05 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Let's pretend that we all stop baiting.

Think about that McDirt!

banghead

Edit: Not all of us know that a bait will actually get that far. Smile

_________________
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Last edited by Corona on Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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npr_listener
Hello I'm New here!


Joined: 18 Sep 2008
Posts: 16


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:11 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Professor So And So wrote:
Out of the couple e-mails that we received from TAL listeners that disagreed with our bait, I chose this one to respond to. I did my best to address every point that she raised, and I felt like it would be worth posting here as well. I think she had a well thought out e-mail, and I hope I did at least a mediocre job at responding to everything.


Thank you so much for posting this well-considered response to that email. ( I think it was much better than mediocre!)

I've read all (currently 135 Exclamation ) pages of the Chad safari thread. The moral and ethical greys of scam baiting are really interesting, as it looks like individual baiters have to wrestle inside themselves to decide what kinds of things are OK, and how far to take them. The baiters running the safari sound like they know what they're doing, and why; some of the ignorant spectator comments made me cringe, though.

I have a few questions for the community at large - I hope it's OK to post them here? I'll put the actual question in bold so you can find it easily - I'm not shouting...

1) I really appreciate your explanation of how you learned more about Abeche from the proprietor of THE ONLY INTERNET CAFE ON HOSPITAL ROAD. Smile Has anyone contributing to the thread actually been to west Africa, besides onyenekwu? Or the third world? (and like Amy said, not on a package tour)

2) To your knowledge, have baiters ever actually used the tactic of sending small amounts of money to encourage the scammer to keep going (and/or to continue communication)? I saw this discussed and shot down, but it seems like it would be a temptation in general. I didn't see it listed in the ethics sticky, but maybe it's somewhere else on this board? It would bother me.

3) What proportion of baiters have a problem with pretending to represent a church?

4) Can someone remind me whether/how it was determined that 'Famous' is a scammer? I'm already wincing about what I *imagine* his fate will be... He sounds genuinely worried about Anita.

Thanks again, Prof, for your answers to the NPR email. If you have time to answer these, that's great - but I know y'all are busy baiting, so no worries if you don't.
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streaded
Master Baiter


Joined: 01 Aug 2008
Posts: 147
Location: Streded in hash conditions


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:25 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

welcome NPR listener
im new here too so cant answer most of your questions but I would have no problem with representing a fake church.
I have never been to africa but about a year after the breakup of the USSR I did briefly visit one of the countries there, I did see poverty and I seen people who worked to better themselves and I suspect there was also quite a bit of scamming going on from there from people who would rather do that than try to better themselves.
I hope that listening to the broadcast has made you more aware and therefore less likley to be scammed and also able to help those near you if anyone tries it on them.

_________________
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jojobean
Baiting Guru


Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 7586
Location: YOU WILL DRINK YOUR URINE IN A COMERCIAL BUS


PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:31 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

npr- Thanks for posing your questions in a coherent manner. That's not the normal format that people use.

npr_listener wrote:
1) I really appreciate your explanation of how you learned more about Abeche from the proprietor of THE ONLY INTERNET CAFE ON HOSPITAL ROAD. Smile Has anyone contributing to the thread actually been to west Africa, besides onyenekwu? Or the third world? (and like Amy said, not on a package tour)


Yes. I have spent time before helping less fortunate people (not Africa though). I have also donated money to such causes. I do plan to, at some point within the next few years, go to Cameroon to help on a medical trip with a friend of mine who is a doctor.

Quote:
2) To your knowledge, have baiters ever actually used the tactic of sending small amounts of money to encourage the scammer to keep going (and/or to continue communication)? I saw this discussed and shot down, but it seems like it would be a temptation in general. I didn't see it listed in the ethics sticky, but maybe it's somewhere else on this board? It would bother me.


No, to my knowledge this has never been done.

Quote:
3) What proportion of baiters have a problem with pretending to represent a church?


A very small amount. I only know a couple who would have such a problem.

Quote:
4) Can someone remind me whether/how it was determined that 'Famous' is a scammer? I'm already wincing about what I *imagine* his fate will be... He sounds genuinely worried about Anita.


Famous and his father are both scammers. I do not doubt he is genuinely concerned about Anita. However, this guy is planning on having sex with a 15 year old. Well, your response might be, "That might not be wrong in Africa." However, he was SO quick to lie about it. He was completely in denial about the whole thing. And yes, I agree that the fate of Famous is far worse than that of Adamu. I would rather be Adamu any day of the week.

I have received this format from Famous:

Quote:
Dear sir/madam,

This is Linda Kofi Princess, I am a citizen of Ghana, the son of the Late King Osei Kofi then second, who is the rightful owner of KEYASE GOLD MINING COMPANY REGION OF GHANA.

My late Father was the director of the company and the King of Bono Royal Kingdom and he makes his step brother Mr.Prince Osei Kofi the Manager of the company, he is in charge of everything because my late father was too old to handle everything on his own and I was too young of year am just only 15years at that time.

My Late father was engulf in a motor accident and he was admitted in the hospital for two solid years, but unfortunately he died but before his death he told me and my little sister Princess Cycilia by name that he is the right owner of the Gold company, that he has deposited some huge amount of Gold with a security company and gave me the valid documents to the company which was (marked) as family Treasure.

After the death of my father, his step brother is raising eyebrow in the company, because he is the Manager of the company and he want to claim to be the rightful owner of the company. My Late father brother is doing everything to have the company.

I have to run for my life because he wants me death, he have killed my mother and my little brother which is 9years, right now am in Ghana where the security company is located, to make them know the nature of what is on ground, and I want them to get me what my late father has deposit with them, but I was told that there was an agreement my late father took with the security company why he was signing the documents. My Biological Father left behind 180kg of Gold and $7.5 Million United State Dollars which he safely lodged (package) into a metallic trunk box and deposited it to a Security Company in the capital town Accra Ghana when he was alive.

I am hereby soliciting your assistance to be my foreign beneficiary/partner/adviser because: When my late father was making the deposit of the trunk box, he undertook an agreement which stated that I must provide a foreign beneficiary/partner to help me claim it. You will be entitled to "thirty Percent" of the total sum of what very is in the trunk box, for your assistance. And after the success of this transaction you are going to make arrangement for me to meet you over in your country for investment of the funds.

I will like you to send to me your direct telephone number for easy communication. And also give you more information on how to make the claims of this trunk box. We will undergo some expenses seeing this transaction through which is one of the reasons I will need your assistance also, but any expenses made shall be taking care of at the end of the transaction.


Looking forward to hearing from you back.

Thank you.

Linda K Princess

_________________
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