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 False name and address given after accident

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falnsb
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 8:30 am Reply with quoteBack to top

A rental car I was driving was hit from behind in UK a few weeks ago. The damage turned out to be minor but what pissed me off big time was that the driver f***ed off and I had to chase him to stop him. He then pretended he didn't know he'd hit me, got abusive and threatening. At that point I should have called the police but really I felt they have more serious things to deal with, so I didn't.

He gave me a name and address, and of course I had the registration of the vehicle. He 'didn't have time' to give me any other details. I passed it all on to the rental and insurance company and it now turns out that he says he was out of the country at the time of the accident. The insurance have asked him for proof.

I do not know if the name and address he gave me were correct. If they are, he is lying about being out of the country on the date of the incident.

If on the other hand he gave a false name and address then this is a police matter and needs to be dealt with as such by the authorities.
Eiher way, he is lying.

The police now say they can do nothing as they were not called to the scene so it is my word against his. He's a pimply 20 year old chav driving a commercial van, but I suppose in law everyone is equal.

Does this sound right? Can anyone give any advice here?

It pisses me off that people can get away with this type of behaviour.

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Afferbecklauder
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:31 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I would assume UK law is on a par with Australia. Therefore the burden of proof lies with the party making the accusation.
Unfortunate but true. This is why the police don't want to know about it. If the chain of evidence is not sound, the prosecutor will not want to take any action.
If the damage is minor, the police do not normally get involved. It is very difficult to make a case under the Westminster system unless all the ducks are in a row.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:47 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Here in NZ there are minimum details that you have to exchange in an accident - and I believe if the likely damage exceeds a certain figure the police should (must?) be called.

Regardless of whether you have any case against him, I would leave it to the insurance company to sort out - that's why you pay it. They have the lawyers and the time so let them worry. As long as you did what could be reasonably expected in the circumstances in order to provide them with the other driver's details, I suspect you are ok apart from the excess.

You could do stuff like staking out the given address to see if he lives there etc etc, but the moment you do, you cross to the wrong side of the line.

Relax.. leave it to the insurance company Smile

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 11:07 am Reply with quoteBack to top

GordonBennett wrote:
Relax.. leave it to the insurance company Smile


Yup - this is pretty much all you can do. It's frustrating and very annoying but without any police involvement during the initial incident you have to let the insurance people duke it out. Was it serious damage or just a bingle?

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 11:30 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Like others said, let the insurance guys run with it - they know their stuff and your guys won't rest until they've sorted it.
If he hit you, there's almost certainly something they will be able to find on his vehicle to prove him a liar.
They'll also ask him for proof that he was out of the country when he claimed to be. Hopefully, he'll have said he was somewhere outside of the EU. If that's the case, he'll be nailed almost immediately as he won't be able to show a passport stamp.
I wouldn't worry about it. It would have been a much more difficult case if the guy had just turned around and said it was your fault. At least this way, he's dug his own grave as, if your insurance company finds the slightest bit of error in his defence, he'll be liable for everything.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:37 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hindsights is a wonderful thing I know, but I'd have noted his number plate, let him drive off and reported it as a hit and run to the police, but I do doff my cap at you for having the gonads to chase him down.

As it's a minor prang chances are neither insurance company will admit liablity and will end up a 50:50, unless he's caught in his obvious lie after which they should slowly roast him till his pimples explode.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:49 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
they should slowly roast him till his pimples explode.


one word. euwwwww

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:18 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hopefully he's in far deeper doodoo for lying about it all. If it was proved he lied about being abroad he has lied to the Police (I supposed if they could be bothered he will have mobile phone records etc).

A friend of mine put a taxdisc from his BMW motorcycle on his BSA, thinking noone would notice. instead of the small fine he would have got for no road tax, he was done for FRAUD.

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wokabo
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:23 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

If he was behaving like that, chances are high the other driver wasn't properly insured. Which sucks even more. You should have called the police (even threatening to do so might have turned him a lot nicer).

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Nelsonsbattle
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 11:29 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

GordonBennett wrote:
Here in NZ there are minimum details that you have to exchange in an accident - and I believe if the likely damage exceeds a certain figure the police should (must?) be called.


In NZ, the Police must be advised only if there is an injury.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:07 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Well, this is a little crazy and stupid, but if he wrote down this stuff, you could always ask to have the piece of paper that was wrote on compared to his own handwriting, but that's a little far off.

Like the others say, you should relax and let the insurance companies handle this. As well, you should have insisted for insurance information and told him something along the lines of "we need to insure accuracy when this is taken to the insurance companies"...

Best of luck.

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freddyfudpucker
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:23 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Here in the U.S., you immediately call the police (generally if you don't someone who saw it will) and he would have been automatically found guilty for fleeing the scene of an accident.

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Gold Hat
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 2:38 am Reply with quoteBack to top

falnsb wrote:
Can anyone give any advice here?


Use the registration to identify the owner of the vehicle. Go to the address and if it is the same person, beat him to death with a tire iron.
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bearkat419
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 3:25 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Yup, around here, if I were in an accident and didn't call the police - someone else would do it for me in short order Shocked

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falnsb
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:38 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Thank you all for your advice and suggestions.

The damage was so minor that had it been my own car I would have hardly noticed it. As it is the rental company wanted to charge me the full excess of 550 but after my protest they reduced it to 50. In any case I have an external 100% CDW policy against which I can claim this back, so I wouldn't end up out of pocket.

I'd also say that had he stopped and been civil about it I'd have told him it didn't matter and that would have been the end of the story.

What's annoying me , and I suppose this is a reason that I, and the rest of us, bait scammers, is the principle whereby people can do wrong with impunity. This little bog rat drove into the back of me (I was stationary, it's not even as if I'd stopped suddenly) through aggression, bad judgment and impatience. He then drove off and had to be chased. Then he was abusive and physically threatening, and finally he lied and/or gave a false name and address.

What happens to him? Nothing.

What happens to me? I might end up 50 worse off. I'm in the fortunate position where 50 really means very little to me, but for many people it is enough to mean they'd go short of something.

And the moral? Perhaps if something like this were to happen again I'd call the police. As I was standing in the street with no access to a telephone enquiry, I would probably have called the emergency number 999, not knowing any other, possibly diverting police resources from a more serious crime.

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YOU BASTED PIG HOW CAN YOU DO THIS TO ME I AM NOT SCAMMER

You are the pertetic fool with no ambition, you wasted our time, by doing this.
You white are reaping what you saw, by enslaving our forfather. if you like publish all your head white still fall for our trick, fool, is better you work with me because am demmm rich.
EAT SHIT IF DO NOT HEAR FROM YOU. MIND YOU YOUR NAME IS WITH MY SPIRITUALIST, YOU ARE ALREADY A MUGU.

you are a fool, your four father first scammed our four fathers. came to africa and stole our rich heritage. suffered us as slaves and killed us like ants. it is time to get back all what your four fathers stole from our four fathers.
we will not stop untill the europeans, americans etc . come begging for forgivenes.
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Standard Procedure
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 7:11 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Gold Hat wrote:
Use the registration to identify the owner of the vehicle. Go to the address and if it is the same person, beat him to death with a tire iron.

I hope that this was a joke!

I say this because of an incident happened almost 10 years ago when I was much younger. At a gas station, someone swerves into us (intentionally) when my dad is fuelling up and immediately accuses my dad of doing this and demands money to pay for it up front, not even asking to exchange insurance information (Minor damage and says it's $350 according to his mechanic!). They get into an argument, and nothing happens, no exchange of information or even a name. We end up driving off, and a week later, at 8 in the evening on a January night, guess who comes knocking? After a shouting match which the whole block probably heard, my parents call the police and file a complaint of harassment with this individual (They had his license plate number), and this person doesn't come back. However, the reason for his non-return happened to be because a restraining order was filed against this person (Something like 10 km), so be careful if you do that!

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Gnasher
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 2:33 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I thought the only way you can identify someone via their car registration is either getting the cops involved or having a 'friend' at the registration centre check for you?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:27 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
In NZ, the Police must be advised only if there is an injury


That makes a lot more sense than what I was sugesting.


Quote:
I thought the only way you can identify someone via their car registration is either getting the cops involved or having a 'friend' at the registration centre check for you?


The law here is about to be changed(?) but you can phone a number up and get the name of the registered owner for $5.
<waiting for NelsonsBattle to correct me Smile >

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Afferbecklauder
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:35 am Reply with quoteBack to top

@ Gnasher !

Indeed that is the case in Oz. You may recall a big crack down on Police and Registry staff illegally using RTA database access a few years back to accommodate friends with that sort of info.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:12 am Reply with quoteBack to top

falnsb wrote:
He 'didn't have time' to give me any other details.

People love to say that to get off the scene.
It happened to me once and I just told the guy "F**k you, you have time as long as I say so!"
May sound harsh, but that's it. He caused the accident, so he has to have time to do all the necessary crap, and even if that involves cinema and dinner, well, then he'll come home late...

In my experience often enough reasoning does not work. I'm a reasonable person, and try to reason where possible, but if I see I'm not getting anywhere I can also get rude, and often enough one sentence like the posted one makes things clearer than 30 minutes of arguing.

So, next time, and we all hope there will be no next time, don't let the guy run away, even if he's the King and Queen of Cheese and needs to get to an important meeting with a couple of jesters...

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Gnasher
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:49 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Afferbecklauder wrote:
@ Gnasher !

Indeed that is the case in Oz. You may recall a big crack down on Police and Registry staff illegally using RTA database access a few years back to accommodate friends with that sort of info.


As far as I know it's the same in the UK too? Only the cops have access to the car reggo database.

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"they are in deed the swinders rotating about in the net and searching for whom they will stylishly defraud your belongings" A. Moron
"Please pray harder for God to guide and protect us during our travelling because flight airplane i observe is a very big risky" Abdul Karibu
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D11
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:35 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

The insurance company will find out his lie in seconds

First if he left the country how did he leave the country - who did he use? when did he book the ticket? What time did he leave etc etc - all very very tracable - were an island theres only 2 ways out swim or use some company lol.

Your word against his -well yea till its discovered he lied - as soon as he is proven to have lied they will automatically accept your version of events and end of story basically - he will cough up.

even if he says he used a private boat owned by a friend - they will ask the foreign port authority for the time and date the boat arrived and or left etc etc, including customs checks - you can sail a boat from the uk to france even without first letting someone each side knowing your going - and if you dont the police will then investigate again so he cant even say a friend took him with them, no matter how you go its traceable and insurance companies dont want to pay - they have investigators that will subject witnesses to what can only be described as torture (joke) to get that information - they will ask every single person in every situation questions - saying your out of the country is the most STUPID excuse as its so easy to prove you were not.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:18 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Standard Procedure wrote:
Gold Hat wrote:
Use the registration to identify the owner of the vehicle. Go to the address and if it is the same person, beat him to death with a tire iron.

I hope that this was a joke!


AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!

Ya know . . . . there was a time around here that a person could make am over-the-top comment like mine and nobody would even bat an eye. It's all so f**king serious now Sad
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 2:57 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Oh no worries, I thought that was advice. Don't take it personally.

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