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 Harry Potter - BOOK 7 SPOILERS OK (WARNING!!!!)

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wayne
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 8:45 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I took the family to see the film Wednesday. I was bored through it all, and the wife fell asleep. To make it worse, she's the HP fan! My youngest came out of the cinema and said "that was crap". There was NO WAY I was going to stand in line like a lemon for the book to be released, so I bought it for the wife the afternoon after. She's reading that now and I'm reading Dearly Devoted Dexter.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:25 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I read pretty much continuously from 5.30pm to midnight last night to finish off the last 360 odd pages of the book. I am looking forward to talking about it tomorrow.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:58 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Woohoo! It dispatched yesterday!

Now I've just got to wait for Royal Snail to get around to delivering it.

Probably the last time I'll pop in here for a while Wink

Edit: Even better news! It's here! Cool

Why the item dispatched on Saturday and the item dispatched yesterday arrived together I don't know. Maybe there were a lot of parcels in the system over the weekend Laughing

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 11:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

2 chapters left to go!!!!!

Wooo hoooo

There will be no spoilers for me on Wed!!

@wayne - - the movies are NO WHERE near as good as the books.

Made use of the handy edit button and combined these posts. TS

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 11:22 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Good for you Eliza. Very Happy The last two chapters are really interesting.

The curfew on spoilers is going to be lifted in about 10 hours. Hopefully that's OK with everyone. I'll change the title of the thread before posting anything.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:30 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I stupidly looked it up on Wikipedia and now know what happens and to whom.

I can reveal that wands and broomsticks are involved Razz

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:42 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I finished the book Sunday evening. I enjoyed it quite a bit.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:04 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

shuntbuzz wrote:
I can reveal that wands and broomsticks are involved Razz


and Kings Cross Laughing

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:24 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

The books give you so much more information then the movies could ever hope to. You'll come to enjoy the movies so much more for it, especially if you're interested in the house elves (a topic barely even touched in the movies, but considerably more so in the books).

I'm of the sort that likes to read the books or match the movies to get more enjoyment of the other, and vice versa. The Harry Potter series is very good at that (if you want to see the reverse go watch Blood & Chocolate then read the book... ). I can only hope when Enders Game finally comes to the big screen that it will follow the book as well as the Harry Potter series has.

I have about 40 pages left to read, which I shall be enjoying on my bus ride home from work Smile

Edit: And for those worried that it is the final book JK is considering writing a book focusing on Albus D. While its not Harry, its the same Author so its bound to be good.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Am I the only one here who on Saturday at midnight went to get it (5 from Asda hooray!) and stayed up till 4 in the morning reading it? No?
Just me then.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:30 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I didn't stand in line for the book, there were stacks of them available. I got it Saturday, finished it last night and am "patiently" waiting for my husband to read it so I can discuss it with him.
I'm glad I'll be able to discuss it on here tomorrow!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 6:48 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I am finished, also.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:15 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Reaper wrote:
shuntbuzz wrote:
I can reveal that wands and broomsticks are involved Razz


and Kings Cross Laughing


Smile OT - My favorite memory of Kings Cross is coming out the KC tube and facing some grungy chav druggie asleep, holding a can of export, lying sprawled in front of the pavement railing with a sign saying "I am dying of cancer - please give generously" UPSIDE DOWN on his chest. Says it all.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:15 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Spoilerssss







Albus Severus Potter Laughing , Ron and Hermione together? Who saw that coming :wink. Dobby shouldn't have died Sad or Fred..

(Would've talked about the ending/fight more, but I have school)

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:28 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Yup it's spoiler time.

We'll keep the print small for a while, but it should be fairly well signposted we're allowing discussion of the book now.

I wrote this when I was halfway through the book:

In the first couple of chapters it felt odd reading a new Harry Potter. With all the fan fiction that I've read in the past, I kept having to convince myself that this was indeed the real deal and not just another story made up by fans of the Harry Potter series. In the first chapter, when all the Death Eaters have congregated at the Malfoy manor I kept remembering the fan fiction story by Cassandra Claire, Draco Dormiens, where Harry and Hermione (along with a rather more friendly than usual Draco) had all ended up at the Malfoy manor for a good chunk of the story. Therefore it was quite tricky in a way to force myself to not think of that fan fiction as actually having happened in a previous year of the character' existence. Some of the exposition in Chapter 2 seemed a little long-winded, but it was interesting to find out about Dumbledore's past a bit more, and I think the doubts that have been cast on Dumbledore (which will possibly turn out to be a red-herring) make an interesting twist for the story, particularly as the continued appearance of Snape as a bad guy (so far) makes us really wonder why Dumbledore ever trusted him, and perhaps makes us wonder a bit more about Dumbledore's long-term intentions.

So far it has felt like a very different Harry Potter to me. Obviously there have been quite a few usual bits missing - no Hogwarts so far and a reasonably seriously reduced character cast for most of the story. It had been good that Hermione has really begun to shine, as I could never understand why she could be considered as anything except for the best wizard/witch of all the younger characters, considering her vast magical knowledge. Parts of their journey have felt quite like "Lord of the Rings" in some ways, when they're always on the move, which is OK but at times a little bit repetitive.

At almost halfway through the book there is an enormous amount of things that remain unresolved. In fact just about all the questions I had at the start of the book haven't really been answered yet. Harry hasn't managed to destroy a single Horcrux, we haven't had final closure on Snape, we don't know who the two main characters who die will be (unless Mad-Eye Moody turns out to be one of them) and we definitely don't know if Harry kills Voldemore, vice-versa, or whether they both die.


And I wrote this when I had finished it:

I spent just about all of Monday evening reading, and eventually at close to midnight managed to read the final page, to discover the final word wasn't scar, and I was done. As JK Rowling has said, scar was in the final sentence, but not the final word. And although I suspected it might have been mentioned because it had disappeared, in the end the scar did remain there, even in the epilouge 19 years later.

But hold on, I'm getting ahead of myself. After my weekend reading I was up to about page 250. So far the book had been fairly interesting, although as I said it felt strange, almost fan fiction like. Trips to Malfoy Manor later in the book reinforced this, while the effects of carrying the locket once again made me think of Lord of the Rings. Slowly the plot really began to pick up, and by the time everyone was ready for the battle at Hogwarts I was ripping through the book. It felt so exciting to be so close to having everything resolved. Yet throughout most of this there were still questions that were unanswered until the final moments - was Snape really a good guy, would Harry have to die to kill Voldemort?

I had suspected Snape would eventually turn out to be a good guy, although it done cleverly for us to think that he wasn't until after he was dead. Lots of things made sense then, and it was exciting to relive Snape's childhood is little bits and pieces, finding out more about Harry's mother in particular. Then finally it seemed as though JK Rowling would do what I had suspected, but had hoped wouldn't be necessary, make it so that Harry was a Horcrux himself and would need to die in order for Voldemort to die. It made good sense though, to kill off the main character in a way that would also defeat his enemy, yet at the same time it was frustrating - and also a bit overly Christian. Harry dying to save everyone else. Then there was the odd scene with Harry and Dumbledore seemingly chatting away, Dumbledore finally filling in all the details that we'd been desperate to find out for ages, and gloriously telling Harry that he wasn't dead, and could continue with his life if he so pleased. We didn't quite know whether Harry was dreaming this, but once he returned we knew he couldn't be defeated by Voldemort, that he would succeed in his mission. In the end, quite amusingly, it was Voldemort's own killing spell which rebounded to kill himself, quite apt I suppose.

The epilouge, which a lot of people have been talking about, I found a bit strange really. Not bad in any way, just truly bizarre to be seeing all these characters so far in the future. I guess the JK Rowling did that so she could make sure it would be very difficult for a sequel or spin-off books to be written. It tells us where things are 19 years in the future - we know that Harry ends up marrying Ginny and that Hermione and Ron also get married (argh that's so wrong!!!) Everything seemed in a strange haze in my mind at that point, a mix of emotions I suppose. Happiness on behalf of these characters, to know that after all they've been through they managed to live happy lives eventually, that they stuck together, that there wasn't a Voldemort junior waiting in the wings. Yet at the same time it was obviously sad personally to realise that this was the end, the last Harry Potter book, that these characters which I had followed through seven books, through literally thousands of pages, were now to leave me, to leave my imagination. It felt strangely similar to the first time I read Lord of the Rings actually, when Frodo goes off to the Grey Havens at the end and you don't really know what's happened, just that it's most definitely finally over, finished. I had expected myself to be ecstatic to finish such a long book, but instead I felt almost mournful that it was over.

Although there were parts of the book that dragged on a little, somewhat typically I suppose of later Harry Potter books, I found myself very impressed by the way in which all these disparate threads of the story came together in a way that nobody could have really anticipated. A lot of my predictions did turn out to be at least partially correct, I suppose. It was a little sad that Neville Longbottom didn't get to take out Bellatrix Lestrange, but in the end Molly Weasley did a good enough job of that. There were also nice touches, such as Harry sharing a sweet moment with his parents, Sirius and Lupin - even though at that stage everyone thought he was headed off to his death; or the way in which Dobby's death was dealt with, and we realised how important and awesome a character he head been. I look forward to seeing how it will be turned into a movie, as there were some parts that will be truly fantastic as a film.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:33 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Spoiler time....WOOOO HOOOO


Well, in the end, I was wondering about the "fog" or what ever (loaned the book to a friend and can't look it up right now) I thought something bad may happen.

She does leave it open, though - for new stories - - just different - - mischievous stories of James and Albus ...........and Scorpius....unless Draco has been dabbing in the black arts now.....I dunno.....

I'd kind of like to know what happened to the Dursley's when they left the Potter house. I would have liked to have seen Neville reunited with his parents when the curse wore off...just to see what they would say to each other after all these years.

I, too, felt the whole "Harry as a sacrifice" so everyone else could live was a bit too Christian. It was too much like Jesus knowing he had to die and walking to his death. They even "Tortured the body" afterward. Yet, I did think it was cool that in the end, it was Voldemort's own spell that killed him. His own spell had put part of himself into Harry - His own spell knocked it out - and then his own spell killed himself.......and I loved the way Harry ended up really being the one with the Elder Wand.

And DID he go back and FIND the stone?? What exactly did he do with the things? Could a kid from Hogwarts find it in the future?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:41 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Yes I guess there are plenty of potential stories in the future, but after that 19 year gap. Perhaps it gives JK Rowling the opportunity to make things different enough that it would be new to her, but still with everything happening in that same world.

Once you've read the book I strongly recommend checking out the wikipedia page relating to it. This cleared up a lot of things I had found confusing in the story and where I had missed something or missed how it linked to something else, the wikipedia page helped pull it all together for me.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:51 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I seriously doubt that anyone will ever find the resurrection stone. Remember the Death Eaters had taken over Aragog's cave, forcing all the lesser spiders out. Once the Death Eaters were gone surely at least a decent amount of the spiders would return there... the ones that weren't killed at the battle of Hogwarts.

So Harry dropped the stone right at that cave, with all those spiders around. I can't see anyone ever just finding it there since Harry is the only one who knows it would be in that area. And even if he did want to go back and get it he'd have to deal with all the spiders and as good as he is sheer numbers would likely do him in.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:10 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I went to the bookstore yesterday and picked up the book -- turned to the back and read the last two chapters, including the epilogue where Harry is all growned up. Wink

I didn't understand all the references obviously, but I got the gist. As I put the book down I looked up and saw two people looking at me aghast. I said: "Do you want to know?" They both shook their heads very fast as if the notion was blasphemous.

Good times.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:28 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

One thing I don't understand.. and maybe its just because JK isn't really into tactics...

The taboo on Vold's name.

The Order could have used this against them so easily. Get as many of the Order and those willing to fight together as you could, with escape plans ready just in case. Have someone say the name. In a few moments some snatchers or Death Eaters will show up... instant ambush.. smoke the bad guys, leave the area post-haste and repeat in a few days. After a few of these ambushes Death Eaters and Snatchers alike would be weary of following the taboo's call.

Of course they'd have to worry about the DE and snatchers showing up after an ambush or two in much superior numbers to turn it against the Order. So between the ambushes you set up false calls. Have someone say the name then apparatate near a protected area and get to safety. So mixed in with the ambushes will be false calls, so the bad guys could never be sure what they were walking into.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:40 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

From memory the taboo on Voldemort's name is explained in book 6 quite well (although I can't remember that explanation). Perhaps in the past when Voldemort was originally powerful he also had some sort of charm on his name (similar to the one that happens in book 7) so that people could be found when they mentioned his name. Therefore people got so used to calling him "You Know Who" and "He Who Must Not Be Named" that it just stuck.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:59 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

My 14 year old son bought his copy at 11.01 Saturday morning (here in NZ, 11 hours ahead of UK) and had it finished by 7 that evening. Then Dad got to read it.

One thing I can't figure out is why the good guys don't use the "Avada Kedavra" curse against the Death Eaters - they only stun them. In the final battle inside the Great Hall Percy floors the Minister of Magic (Thicknesse), yet earlier in the battle Percy had jinxed the same Minister of Magic and made the comment that he was resigning (The only joke Percy had ever made, just before Fred is killed). Now if the good guys had used the "Avada Kedavra" curse then soon Voldemort would have run out of supporters.

But JKR was right, a "couple" of major characters did get killed - Mad Eye Moody, Dobby, Fred, Snape, Lupin and Tonks.

However, hats off to JKR. She's got a whole generation of kids interested in reading books - she deserves every Pound she's earned.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:13 am Reply with quoteBack to top

^^ I guess it's one way of distinguishing between the "good guys" and the "bad guys". However surely Molly Weasley used that curse on Bellatrix Lestrange to end up killing her?

Remember that these are unforgivable curses, that in times of peace simply using one would give you a one-way ticket to Azkaban. Didn't stop Harry from using the Imperius Curse again and again at Gringott's though.

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Tsnerd
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:20 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I think it comes down to killing only when necessary instead of killing because you enjoy it.

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rindaris
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 2:09 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Josh wrote:
^^ I guess it's one way of distinguishing between the "good guys" and the "bad guys". However surely Molly Weasley used that curse on Bellatrix Lestrange to end up killing her?


I don't believe it was the AK 'killing' curse that Molly used on Bellatrix, cause Bellatrix didn't just die.. she kinda blew up if I recall.

But another reason the good guys wouldn't have wanted to kill all the 'bad guys' is ones like Stan who were surely under the influence of the Imperio curse and were never truly bad guys. The real bad guys might not have a problem killing innocents, but thats what sets the good guys apart.

And the Taboo set up in the 7th book was never even hinted at before, since Moldybutt (if you've seen The Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy you get the joke) never came to full power before and couldn't set this up, it seems like something he needed the Ministeries power for.

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