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wenar
Not quite a Newb


Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 26


PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:31 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I apologise for my bad English, I will do my best to explain.

My father is a wealthy man and I believe he has been attacked for this. This is how I, his son understand the situation. (I will change the names, but the amount and the countries will be the same).

We are originally from Iraq but moved to Sweden in 1988 when Saddam started his Anfal campaign against the Kurds. After the first gulf war the Allied forces set up a No-Fly Zone on the Kurdish areas, this was an opportunity for my father to return to his homeland and he did so. He built up a considerable wealth, not by stealing or being corrupt, but in an honest way. This is how he got his wealth. Now to the start of what I believe is a scam.

In November 2006 a man from Basra in southern Iraq came to my father asking for help. His economic situation was bad and my father helped him. After knowing each other for a month or so, this man, we can call him Mohammed, told how his divorced wife married a wealthy man and how they both died in a car accident. (I checked up some 419 scams and saw that this is one of the methods of how these scammers get to you). Mohammed had a child with his first wife, and this child (under aged) is the sole survivor and relative of the killed couple. So Mohammed will indirectly through his child inherit approximately 20,000,000 $. I want to add that this wealthy man that died was a famous man and I think that my father know of him (this is what my father told me, but I am not sure that this known man had any relations to Mohammed, who I believe just snapped on the idea of using his death for his own profit).

Mohammed said that he had legal issues getting to this money, but he has the necessary documents allowing him to control the money instead of his under aged child. The second problem was that the money was in Togo (or Ghana, I am not sure in which it was originally). Mohammed had tried for over a year to get that money sent from Togo to Iraq or Dubai, where he could easily get it. What he asked for my father to do was to bring the money to Iraq and he could then take his share.

So my father and a friend who we can call Abdul goes to Togo (Abdul was also an investor in this project and is a victim of this scam. My father did not know Abdul before this incident and started to know him through Mohammed). There he meets with Mohammed’s lawyer (I am not sure if he was Mohammed’s lawyer before my father went to Togo or not). His name is Barrister Peter Boko and his company is Boko & Boko Chambers (I made up the name, but it looked something like that). In Togo my father got the full power of attorney from Mohammed. My father sees the money with his own eyes and it was the 20,000,000 $ in 2 boxes. It looked like this:

http://www.joewein.de/sw/img/419moneybox.jpg

(I found this image after doing research; my father has another picture of the boxes taken from another angle).

Mohammed said that he had been in Togo before and seen the money, counted it, and even made a small withdrawal in cash. This all happened before my fathers trip to Togo. This is also when they “washed” the money. It had some purple/black paint on it and there was a large payment to wash it. I believe it was something like 150,000 $. My father did not watch this personally, but Mohammed showed him a video where they do this.

Back to my fathers trip; After paying large sums of money, the 2 boxes were transferred to Ghana, and there we got even more documents, like the UN “non-money laundry” and “non-terrorist” and “non-drug” documents (I also know these are not issued by the UN and that these are standard among scammers). After getting some official “non inspection” documents from the ministry of interior in Ghana and after getting an insurance of “non delivery” (which cost about 100,000 $, the 2 boxes is flown to Amsterdam and later to Brussels. My father goes to Belgium and this is where I come in to the picture. Abdul went back to Dubai so I had to act as a translator. My father explains the whole thing to me and shows me the documents and all. I truly believed this was all legit. He had met with bank officials and government officials and a bunch of other people in Ghana and Togo. (I have some pictures of them but I am not sure if I want to put them out here).

So the 2 boxes containing the 20,000,000$ goes to a Dexia bank (for some very strange reason without us knowing why it went to that bank and why we were not contacted first). A man from the National Bank of Ghana flew to Brussels to act as our “contact” of some sort. He was to make sure that we received the money. This man can be called Kobo. Kobo contacts some officials from the Dexia bank, and we all meet with them. There were 3 bank officials and they said that we need 55,000 € to open a special bank account so that the 20,000,000 $ + the 55,000 € can be placed in it. The 55,000 € is some kind of guarantee so that government officials in Belgium don’t get suspicious of the large amount of money on a personal account. They also said that it would be necessary to make our account 3 years old and “place” the money in bits over “time”. They could do this because they were officials of the bank. We paid the 55,000 € and were told to wait for a few days until the paper work was done and until a judge stamps it. After waiting in Belgium for a week and paying another 1,000 $ to “bribe” a lawyer they had we get a message saying that the government is demanding 450,000 € in tax. 1 % for 3 years (remember that the money was there for “three” years). 1 % X 15,000,000 € X 3 = 450,000 €.

We refused and told them that it was their fault that they had to make the account 3 years old. We said that they should start all over with a fresh account and put the 20,000,000 $ (which was turned in to 15,000,000 €) and that we would take the consequences of the Belgium government, if there would be any, ourselves. The bank officials then said that they can make it 1 year old and that they could also pay the 1 % in tax as long as we pay them after we get the money. We accepted it, but they then say we need to pay 40,000 € because they could not “hide” the large payment without real high bank officials know about it. We refuse and call for a fresh account again.

Now all of a sudden the bank officials in Brussels don’t answer our phone calls and the 2 boxes have been sent back to Ghana. In Ghana, the “officials” there say that they can transfer the money to Europe, but it will cost us 50,000 $. We have not paid this sum yet, but my father is considering it, or trying to get a guarantee that we will pay them 100,000 $ if the money reaches us. I went back to Sweden with my father (he needed a vacation) and this is where I looked up all the names and everything else. I learn about this 419 scam thing and recognize a lot of it. I tell my father and he believes the money, the picture is showed earlier, is Mohammed’s for real, but that the scammers are using it to scam other people. We called Mohammed and he swears that it is his money. Abdul now believes it is a scam. The poor guy lost about 150,000 $ on this business. My father lost 700,000 $ in total. And Mohammed lost some too. All in all, this problem has cost us over 1,300,000 $.

We have hired a top lawyer in Belgium who is investigating the stuff that happened there. He is having a meeting with the federal police as I write this and Mohammed still holds on to the belief that the money is his and that it is real.

I think that it can all be solved if we get the real information from Mohammed, he should not lie or hide ANY information and come clean. He says that he have already.
What I need to know is if anyone has seen this picture before and when it was (it what year?)
Or perhaps on a different angle? Is there a way for us to get our invested money back?

http://www.joewein.de/sw/img/419moneybox.jpg

I want to know what all of you experienced anti-scammers think regarding ANY part. I will gladly answer ANY questions you have and I will continue to ask my father anything you might think will be useful.

NEW INFO:
My father went to a Dexia bank and saw the 2 boexes and the money inside a vault meant for private people).

NEW INFO:
I have new info regarding the 55,000 € requested by the Dexia officials. I remembered that one of the Dexia guys (Top Dexia official was actually a female) went to Dubai to collect it in person. Before receiving the money from Abdul checked his passport to see if it really was the Dexia official sent from Brussels. We now know his real name, if he wasn’t using a fake passport that is…

I am also sorry for the length of this post.


Last edited by wenar on Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:41 pm; edited 4 times in total
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morbiczer
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Joined: 14 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
Location: Budapest


PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Hello,

there are far more experienced people here on the boards, so expect much better advice from them soon, but here is what I can tell you:

1. Yes, this is 100% a scam.
2. The way I understand it from your post, Mohammed was part of the scam.
3. Sadly I don't think there is any chance that you will get back any of your stolen money.
4. The picture of the trunkboxes looks familiar to me. I think I recognize the stupid flower motive on the box in the right. I probably have seen it before here on this site.
5. Are you 100% sure, that the Belgian lawyer you are dealing with right now is real, and not part of the scam?

Sorry to read about all your troubles.
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DrWho
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I saw this picture in 2004. It is a standard picture used by many scammers. There is another picture from a reverse angle. I've seen the video also.

I doubt any information you have about the scammer is real. This is a classic scam, using all of the standard methods we have seen. Sorry. I doubt you will get the money back as they would have disappeared into the country under new names.

And did you contact the lawyer on your own or was he recommended by someone? The possibility of the lawyer being part of the scam is a real possibility.

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hugh_ben_pond
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 7:44 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I'm very sorry wenar, it sounds like your father and others have lost so much...All I can say is hold onto any evidence possible to use against these scammers, any papers with fingerprints, etc...its the only way the government will track them down...other than that I wish I knew more to help you

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wenar
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 26


PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 7:55 am Reply with quoteBack to top

The lawyer in Belgium is well known and we contacted him ourselves. I figured that Mohammed is part of the scam, but it sounds so unbelivable that he contacted my father in person. There is no problems with Mohammed, we can arrest him. As for documents with fingerprints, I am already on that. I have told my father to not touch them anymore. We have not told the lawyer in Belgium anything about what we think it is. We want to see what he thinks about it. Also, as I mentioned earlier, we have photo/sound evidence of atleast 3 of them and fingerprints of probably everyone.

Thanks for your help, I would be very thankful if you could come with recomendations.
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Gnasher
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:34 am Reply with quoteBack to top

wenar - I am very sorry but your father is the innocent victim of a scam and any money he has already paid has been stolen by these criminals. Please try to convince him not to send any more money no matter how convincing their promises and reassurances. To be honest with you I think that paying a real Belgian lawyer to try and track them down, let alone prosecute them, is going to cost even more money for no result.

If you have reliable information as to their real identies and whereabouts then by all means take your evidence to the police but I'm afraid there is probably very little they can do because these criminals operate in different countries and different jurisdictions using fake names, addresses, etc etc.

This is news I am sure you didn't want to hear, but be thankful that you have realised what is going on and hopefully you can convince your father to cease all further communication with the scammers and to ignore all their pleas and promises that this matter can be resolved.

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rumbero
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I also am very sorry to hear about this. As mentioned before the money just like the boxes have disappeared.
I would advice you to be very careful if you are to try and get these criminals arrested.

1. they have vital and true information about your father and his friend.

2. These criminal will make contact with you saying that they have the information and means to bring the scammer to justice.

3. What ever you do please inform the authorities of this.

4. Mohammad is part of the scammers.

5. I see very little the lawer can do about your case. Sorry

Preserntly I am baiting some scammers who are using the same boxes of money. These ones are claiming to be American soldiers.

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morbiczer
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:16 am Reply with quoteBack to top

rumbero wrote:
2. These criminal will make contact with you saying that they have the information and means to bring the scammer to justice.


I think this is a very important point. A common "modality" (= modus operandi) by these groups is to contact the victim in the name of some law enforcement agency once the victim has realized this is a scam, and doesn't pay anymore. They will say that they'll help in getting back the money, but sooner or later there will be again fees, bribes, etc., but of course they'll never pey you a cent. Don't fall for them.
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Slightlyoutofit
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:10 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:31 am by Wienar:

We have hired a top lawyer in Belgium who is investigating the stuff that happened there. He is having a meeting with the federal police as I write this



You have a lawyer who starts work that early?

Quote:
We are originally from Iraq but moved to Sweden in 1988 when Saddam started his Anfal campaign against the Kurds.


Just a question: I know Anfal got heavy in '88, but didn't it actually begin in '86?


Found the same photo too.

Image

All I had to do was type in Google "419+money+box".

Very weird though. First picture was the exact same site that you linked to.

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God will see you true for all this you have done to me you bastard. - Collins Kalu
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BarneyGumble
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:11 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
A common "modality" (= modus operandi) by these groups is to contact the victim in the name of some law enforcement agency


One of my characters has currently got Interpol recovering some money that was scammed out of him. They have traced the criminal down and under sever interrogation have extracted the money out of him.The funny thing about this is that my character has never been scammed and now interpol wants a Western Union money transfer, probably to pay for their rubber truncheons or perhaps the electricity.

There is no depth so low that the lads won't stoop to if a Western Union transfer is a possibility.

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also aware that this is not fraud as others do

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Slightlyoutofit
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:30 am Reply with quoteBack to top

The box first appeared on the Eater here:

http://www.419eater.com/html/mike_nkomo.htm

Wasn't there originally a poll on this topic?

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God will see you true for all this you have done to me you bastard. - Collins Kalu
MAY THE HAND THAT TYPE ON KEYBORD BECOME STRICKEN AND TRANSMIT VIRUS TO YOU ENTIRE BODY. - Dr Linda Akeem
oh what a mess its time cabbage punks like u will be expose for trully what they are. - David Cole
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Scam Patroller
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi, as others have said, that trunk box of cash is very well known, most baiters have had the trunk box photo sent to them by a scammer at some time, you can see a number of different trunk boxes that scammers use on this page, not that the one you were sent is called the "classic" because it is used by scammers so often:

www.scamorama.com/moneypic.html

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wenar
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 2:55 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Thank you, I now understand that the boxes are commonly used. My father said that he saw the same boxes in the vault in Belgium.

I will ask him later today if it was Mohammed that took the pictures or if they were sent to us. I think he once said Mohammed took them. Also I will ask him once again if it was the exact same boxes he saw in Belgium.
(I forgot to put this in the original text, but my father actually got to see the money in a Dexia bank. I think it was owned by a private person and not by the bank or by any firm).

Quote:
You have a lawyer who starts work that early?


Yes we hired him after we stopped hearing from the Dexia "officials"

Quote:
Just a question: I know Anfal got heavy in '88, but didn't it actually begin in '86?


It happened 1986, but it took us 2 years to travel to Sweden.

Quote:
Wasn't there originally a poll on this topic?


Yes there was, I guess the admins removed that? Surprised
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luckey
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 4:29 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
...I tell my father and he believes the money, the picture is showed earlier, is Mohammed’s for real, but that the scammers are using it to scam other people.


Sadly, I've read a few victims’ accounts where they persistently believe they are dealing with the real thing, and only other people are being scammed.

I sincerely hope you are able to convince your father that this is a scam, before anything else is lost.
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it wasn't me
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:23 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Call me sceptical, but something just doesn't ring true. Confused

(Ok, let the slaps begin...)

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DrWho
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 2:34 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Well. Baiters tend to be a suspicious lot. Don't they.

_________________
"i think you people do not know whom you are talking of,i am not in any terrorist organization or planning any such of terrorist activities."
"i am not a terrorist and your america cia cna also investigate me."
"i am not a terrorist.send the shit stuff and let me get it fillied."

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frankspencer970
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:11 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Yep, I was thinking the same thing myself.

Question
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GomerPyle
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:22 am Reply with quoteBack to top

No slap yet - 'it wasn't me' - and I'm not delivering one

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Slightlyoutofit
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I'd have to agree. There is so much that doesn't add up.

I asked why the lawyer started so early as Wenar stated that he was talking to the police as he was posting. Look at his post time. What lawyer starts that early in the morning?

Wenar stated that Anfal started in 88. I do think that a genuine Kurd would have written 86. Why trivialise what was one of the biggest genocides against his own people?

The missing poll is very suspicious. The question was: I have been scammed - Do I need help. Options for answers were - Yes, No, Don't know.
Why give the options No and Don't know? Why make a poll at all? And then an admin mysteriously deletes the poll?


Wenar states that his English is poor. Yet when you take a look at his post, his grammar is excellent. In fact (and no offence to anybody) it is way better than the vast majority of English speakers here.
For somebody who also claims to be Kurdish, how come he used the English words for Basra and Mohammed?
Take a look at your lads' letters. You'll find that the punctuation is terrible - it's normally the first thing that goes out the window. Yet Wenar's punctuation is pretty perfect. And his spelling? Sheesh!! There aren't even that many typos!! The few words that are out of place seem to be forced.

The photo of the money was posted here on the Eater, but it's also the first photo on Google. That kinda makes me suspicious too. Especially after he claims that his father has seen the money. Why wouldn't the scammer just take a genuine photo of that?

Then there's the editing. Not only have things been added. But things have been changed in the original post. It's almost like Wenar is treating his post as a work of art - nipping back and touching things up here and there.

And why the name Wenar? It's not Kurdish. Although you may find a couple of Norwegians with that name, it's a bit too close to the American "Weener" for my liking. Is it an in-joke?

If this is in the hands of the police, why would Wenar come and post here in the first place? The first thing any lawyer or police officer will tell you is "Don't discuss the case with anyone as you may prejudice the enquiry". Why take that risk for what seems to be such a lot of money? Just to authenticate a photo? A photo that he found by "researching" and a photo that he would know that we had seen before if he did the tiniest little bit more "research". In fact, in finding that photo (it's on a baiter's site), how did he miss that fact that it's known to be tied in with scamming? Again - take a look at Goggle images.

I could go on. There is lots in Wenar's post that just doesn't make sense. Lots of little trivialities that when added up convince me that this is a joke.
If I'm wrong then I do obviously apologise, but I'm pretty sure that I won't owe an apology.

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God will see you true for all this you have done to me you bastard. - Collins Kalu
MAY THE HAND THAT TYPE ON KEYBORD BECOME STRICKEN AND TRANSMIT VIRUS TO YOU ENTIRE BODY. - Dr Linda Akeem
oh what a mess its time cabbage punks like u will be expose for trully what they are. - David Cole
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Gnasher
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:33 am Reply with quoteBack to top

In retrospect I have to agree. The excellent 'bad' English is a big enough clue. It's actually very hard to write bad English if you are already a native or fluent speaker. The other stuff doesn't add up either. Oh well, I consider myself punked (and will happily apologise too if necessary) Rolling Eyes

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"they are in deed the swinders rotating about in the net and searching for whom they will stylishly defraud your belongings" A. Moron
"Please pray harder for God to guide and protect us during our travelling because flight airplane i observe is a very big risky" Abdul Karibu
"WE DOESN'T LIKE HOW DISOBIDIENT YOU ARE!" Coco Law Chambers
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wenar
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Slightlyoutofit

I don't know where to start, however I will try my best to cover all of your statements.
Regarding your questions about the lawyer and why he started to work so early: I don’t know if the forum adjust the time stamp after local time or not, but as you know, I am writing from Europe, so in that sense he was starting early. I would also like to remind you that it’s Easter and that most government institutions are either closed or close early. So our lawyer might have taken the opportunity before the “real” holiday starts. I was either now (Friday) or a week later.

On the subject of the Anfal campaign. I honestly did not think that anyone would know anything, or be as informed as you are about the Anfal. So I spared both of our times by simplifying it, however I know that the subject is far too important to simplify, therefore I apologize to not only my people but to anyone else that might have gotten offended.

I can’t say much about my English being better then I proposed. I assumed this would be a site preliminary for English speaking users and I did not think my English would reach the standard. However, I am thankful for your kind words (if I may take them as a complement). I study political science at the University of Stockholm and most of our courses and books are in English, I will also let you on a little secret of mine. I used Microsoft Word to write the first post just to make sure I had few typos.

About me using the English term for Basra and Mohammed. As you may know, we Kurds don’t have much in common with the rest of Iraq and most of us do not speak Arabic. I used the English term because I did not know the Arabic one. And Mohammed was just a name I came up with (the same with my nick “Wenar”). If your read the original post, you might notice that one of the first things I said was that I would not use the original names, this is also because the lawyer said that we should not talk to anyone about this case. I am writing this without the knowledge of my father and I try to give you as few details as possible without undermining the whole story.

I am going to be honest as to why I came here in the first place. I was sceptical and I was not sure about many things. My father seemed to believe it was not a scam or that if it was, the money was at least real and it belonged to “Mohammed”. He gave me a few convincing proof: A) he saw the boxes in Brussels (I still have to ask him again if it was the exact same boxes). B) He trusts Mohammed and his story. C) Mohammed’s ex-wife and his husband were famous (I assume that he knows if there is a connection between them and Mohammed). D) One of the scammers was very eager and called us all the time wanting to know if we got the money. Along with a few other things that I do not want to go in to.

As I wrote my original post I became more and more convinced that it was a scam. I don’t know why, but maybe it helped to write on a paper and seeing the truth “black on white” as we say in Swedish.

Slightlyoutofit I am glad you criticized my post. A lot of people were probably thinking the same thing and I hope I can clarify a few things with this post.
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Don
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

wenar wrote:
I study political science at the University of Stockholm and most of our courses and books are in English


Kudos to the University of Stockholm. Thumbs up Just out of curiosity: Which country are you actually posting from right now?

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wenar
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:55 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Stockholm, Sweden.
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wenar
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Posts: 26


PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:56 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:55 am

I just noticed the forum does not go after local time. It is 14:00 right now, or 02:00 PM
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GomerPyle
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:10 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You're correct Gnasher, faking being a non-English speaker through your writing is immensley difficult and a Russian attempt will differ widely from an Iraqi attempt, with phonetic errors requiring an insight into that culture and language.

He is English - not American though. Cool

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