SmartFeedSmartFeed          

Porsche Hangout


WELCOME - YOU ARE CURRENTLY VIEWING 419EATER AS A GUEST

By joining our community you will have the ability to post topics and access other forums reserved for members. Registration is quick, simple and absolutely free. Join our community today by clicking here.

ScamWarners.com - Internet Anti-Fraud Center - now open!


 Ethics, ITP's, definitions of, & what is acceptable thre

View next topic
View previous topic
 
Post new topicReply to topic
Author Message
Poison Ivy
419Eater is my life


Joined: 13 May 2007
Posts: 351
Location: England UK


PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:08 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You will have to lend me some then Very Happy

_________________
and i have told you severally and stop pulling my legs - [email protected] K3vin

you know the amount we are talking here is not a peanut .

U're a slot!!
View user's profileSend private message
GordonBennett
Baiting Guru


Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 2829
Location: Pedicabo ego vos et irrumabo


PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:15 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Laughing
Actually - ..GWB wants the choir to perform the Monty Python fish slapping dance.. live feed to the Whitehouse.. dossier comes announcing lad is scammer.. GWB cancels on the spot.. fish-holding people vent frustration..

Come on SP, you can do it (have I just shot myself in the foot regarding ethics?) Very Happy

_________________
Ninja
DIE MUDER FUCKER

Purple Flower
View user's profileSend private message
Scam Patroller
Baiting Guru


Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 11852
Location: UK


PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:17 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

^^^^^ Don't tempt me Laughing

_________________
Pith Helmet 10 Safari Safari Safari Safari Safari Safari Safari Safari Suitcase
40x Nigeria 4x South Africa 2x Ghana 2x Benin 10x Ivory Coast 34x United Kingdom 17x United States 9x Spain 1x Belgium 1x 6x European Union 4x Canada 1x New Zealand 6x Netherlands 1x pyramid 23x Cellphone Jolly Roger
Vcamera YMCA Vcamera Summer Holdiay + Bus Hijack

www.scamwarners.com - www.scam-info-links.info - www.aa419.org - The Numpties Gallery
View user's profileSend private message
Poison Ivy
419Eater is my life


Joined: 13 May 2007
Posts: 351
Location: England UK


PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:33 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I'd love to see them do Fork Handles.

_________________
and i have told you severally and stop pulling my legs - [email protected] K3vin

you know the amount we are talking here is not a peanut .

U're a slot!!
View user's profileSend private message
Jimmy Jazz
Master Baiter


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 174
Location: Slowly going around the bend


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:01 am Reply with quoteBack to top

GordonBennett wrote:
And is JimmyJazz's avatar Iggy Pop? I gots to know Smile


It sure is.

And there endeth my involvement in this particular thread!

_________________
After all I have done for you, you still have the UTAHCITY to call me a fool - J*hn 1gwe

I like you because I can sense some kind of strictness in you which reassures me that you are a straigth forward person - [email protected] [email protected]

"I must tell you that you must be one of these internet bugs parasites" - An ongoing lad.

ASSHOL, EAT YOUR DEFICATE., USELESS SOON OF BITCH, POLICT TOILET AND A MISSRABLE ONDIGAR BORN TO BE FAUSTRATED FOR LIFE THAT IS WHAT YOUR ARE.OK - Barrister D0ugla5 Clarl3

pony Closed lad accounts x 4
View user's profileSend private message
Corona
Eater's sweetheart


Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 8609
Location: On ya left!


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

oops Embarassed

Sorry Corona Sad

_________________
Pretty Rose Pretty Rose Pretty Rose pony pony pony Nurse Nastys Audi TT Nurse Nastys Audi TT Nurse Nastys Audi TT GoatGoatGoatEaster EggEaster 2015Mc Fry Mc Fry
Mortarx? Closed lad accountsx? Pith Helmet
Free Pastor Frank
An Eater's Sweetheart Safari
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Flag Whore


Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2543
Location: 6°27′11″N 3°23′45″E


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Foss wrote:
@red That is really the gist of the argument. the question you have to ask is whether the 3rd parties would have performed the task if it wasn't for the baiter? Would they, in their day to day living/working/existing have performed this activity if the baiter had not been involved.

If you say no, then the baiter does have some kind of involvement in the scamming of individuals. Just because the baiter personally didn't approach the ITP themselves doesn't mean that they can remove themselves from the responsibility of the actions of the scammer.
Refer to my post pages back regarding the case in NZ were the guys motivating another man to commit armed robberies we held responsible for the murders that occurred. they didn't commit the offence, nor did they suggest that he committed the murders, but they influenced him to proceed in a course of action which resulted in them occurring.



I hear what you're saying, but:

1. The example you gave about the armed robberies was a legal example, not an ethical one.

2. Would they have performed this if the baiter hadn't been involved?

No.

Are they suffering as a result of the baiter being involved?

No.

If they suffer at all it is a result of the scammer being involved, not the baiter.

You tell your lad to go and pick something up from WU and off he goes. Now when he gets there expecting his pay cheque and finds he has nothing he is wasting the time of the clerk at WU and more than likely berating the clerk for failing to find his payment.

Did the 3rd party suffer as a result of what the baiter did or as a result of what the scammer did?

Remember... the scammer is the one who initiates these activities.

The baiter simply goes along with it.

Don't confuse your personal morals with ethics in general.

Ethical consideration is about compromise and reality. In a perfect world scammers would only hurt themselves and no one else... but that's not the reality we live in and if you were to take the strict view that ITPs could not be involved even as a possibility then baiting would become near impossible.

The ITPs in the village people gig presumably know who he is. Beyond that, you could send them an email warning them who he is... but if they continue to choose to do what he wants, then so be it. They are not suffering.

If you were to lodge a writ for 'psychological damages' every time you got disappointed you'd be a poor man.

The worst that will is happen is that they are back in exactly the same place as where they started, except this time, they have something to show for it. And someone to blame. The lad.
View user's profileSend private message
Gantz
419Eater is my life


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Sitting on the most uncomfortable chair it has ever been my misfortune to own. It numbs my bum :(


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

*sigh*

Idea

You know, scammers are actually a lot like the Nazis...

_________________
Darling i really don'y like spaeking about sex orally because it is against my religion,i prefer we praticalized it - The lovely Sandr@
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Flag Whore


Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2543
Location: 6°27′11″N 3°23′45″E


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:11 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Gantz wrote:
*sigh*

Idea

You know, scammers are actually a lot like the Nazis...


More like the bay of pigs surely?

I mean, my lad is clearly more akin to JFK's advisers Very Happy


fair point cobber, OT duly noted...
View user's profileSend private message
Gantz
419Eater is my life


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Sitting on the most uncomfortable chair it has ever been my misfortune to own. It numbs my bum :(


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:22 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I think you misunderstood red. Follow this Link to see what I meant.

_________________
Darling i really don'y like spaeking about sex orally because it is against my religion,i prefer we praticalized it - The lovely Sandr@
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Flag Whore


Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2543
Location: 6°27′11″N 3°23′45″E


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:47 am Reply with quoteBack to top

No no, i understood, it is a forum phenomenon everywhere.

I was just taking the mickey (admittedly poorly).


Completely out of line statement removed. - Lotta
View user's profileSend private message
Gantz
419Eater is my life


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Sitting on the most uncomfortable chair it has ever been my misfortune to own. It numbs my bum :(


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:51 am Reply with quoteBack to top

*stays quiet*

_________________
Darling i really don'y like spaeking about sex orally because it is against my religion,i prefer we praticalized it - The lovely Sandr@
View user's profileSend private message
lotta
Baiting Guru


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 13613
Location: 2 Speckled Cct Springfield Lakes QLD 4300


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:01 am Reply with quoteBack to top

@red

I've removed that ridiculous statement you made in your last post.


Image

_________________
<a href="/forum/donate.php">[Click here to donate to 419Eater.com]</a> Lead Support Contact for Missing Posts - (pm me)

Nigeria bank kills South Africa Netherlands Netherlands United Kingdom United Kingdom United Kingdom United Kingdom Spain Spain Spain United Arab Emirates
star star
Mortar Nurse Nastys Audi TT Mc Fry

Alan James Watson (AKA Bi Gal, AKA Big Al, AKA De Master Yoda) -2007, 2008, 2009, 2010 "Doos of the year" award winner

Frederick Fokker:
"I am giving you about a month to get your act together, i am cutting you and the eater a bit of slack"
Dec 11, 2007

Elton Purple Flower Black Ribbon Flying Monkey
View user's profileSend private message
frankireland
Elite Baiter


Joined: 03 Dec 2003
Posts: 1171
Location: Dublin


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 4:05 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Oh dear another ethics thread. Foss, SP himself said he felt sorry for the choir singers, i think we all agree on that (about the innocent ones anyway)
I am sure however that most of them know that the man is a scam artist.
The culture over there glorifies them. I bet you havn't seen the Nigerian video 'I go chop your dolla, you be the mugu, i be the master' Look at it and you will see.
Nobody was hurt, in fact the only person likely to be hurt is the scammer himself.
End of story,hell the choir may even have benefited from the extra practice.
Keep posting though Foss, discussion and debate are healthy, just in this particular instance I think it is safe to say that here most people will agree to disagree with you.

_________________
the doctor said that i think so much that was why i was badly attack by sickness

HOW CAN YOU EAT YOUR CAKE AND HAVE IT?

what i suggest we do is since you want to go into importation of drugs are you sure it is a good business venture to invests the funds in ?

Fake bank kills United Kingdom United Kingdom Ivory Coast Nigeria China
Mortar x21
View user's profileSend private message
Gantz
419Eater is my life


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Sitting on the most uncomfortable chair it has ever been my misfortune to own. It numbs my bum :(


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 4:27 am Reply with quoteBack to top

OMG! I've not seen that vid before. I wonder if it's the nigerian version of "Gangsta" rap?

A link to that would be a great insult in a dolla chop bait. Twisted Evil I s'pose that's been said before considering how old the vid is.

_________________
Darling i really don'y like spaeking about sex orally because it is against my religion,i prefer we praticalized it - The lovely Sandr@
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Flag Whore


Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2543
Location: 6°27′11″N 3°23′45″E


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:15 am Reply with quoteBack to top

@foss and frank - very true about their society glorifying scammers.

Really good 60 minutes piece on the scams, that i'm sure was discussed to death here, showed that in Nigeria that it someone is seen to be cool or great if they can make money out of doing nothing.

Moreover, when police come in to shut down scamming rings etc the locals riot.

Why? because they're all getting rich off it. Maybe not all directly, but in general, they're all profiting from it.

You should have seen these people, they were pelting the police vans with rocks etc and shots were fired.

these 'ITPs' know exactly what's going on.

It really begs the question... if someone unwillingly participates in a scam are they in fact ITPs at all?

THEY are the ones scamming... if your mate told you that GWB was going to shout you a visa into the US if you dance a little what would you say?!
View user's profileSend private message
Inspector Gadget
Angel of unrealistic meetings


Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 6187
Location: Trumpton


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 6:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

This thread seems to be going adrift.

Who has got the keys?

_________________
Easter 2015 x2 Pith Helmet Co bait with Rumbero Sao Tome island to Gabon van donation
Pith Helmet Co bait with Jayhawk and VJD. Stanley's bottle tour Aba to Lagos
Pith Helmet Pith Helmet Team Hector, airport in installments and St Louis to Kayes
Pith Helmet Halil, Cotonou to Accra
Pith Helmet + Sand Timer Precious 10/08/11
Cellphone x8 Nigeria Spain Mortar x34 Closed lad accounts x 73 Goat
grown up man like him, still doing all this shit games - Stanley, (he doesn't like Parcel Direct)
You again do the strange reflections stuffed with drugs? - Natalia
Sand Timer x3 Hector 24/1/13 Sand Timer Moses 15th Oct 2011
Pretty Rose Sand Timer x 2Mick Ole 11th Sept 2014-16 Sand Timer Asare Akuffo start 4th Aug 2014
View user's profileSend private messageSkype Name
Foss
Master Baiter


Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 170
Location: Somewhere, over the rainbow, way up high


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:53 am Reply with quoteBack to top

@red

Didn't see the 60 minutes piece, but I'll take your word for it. To tell you the truth, I never really considered the macroeconomic effects of a scam. When they come into money, of course they have to spend it, which is most likely to be in their local communities benefiting their community as a whole. Therefore you may be right, in that the whole community would know why they have cash, would know where is came from, and is more than happy to go along with it, because at the end of the day they know that they in fact also become beneficiaries of the scam.

I never considered it from that point of view. Won't make me change my mind approach to a bait, but it was exellent food for thought.
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Flag Whore


Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2543
Location: 6°27′11″N 3°23′45″E


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:57 am Reply with quoteBack to top

[quote=foss]Won't make me change my mind approach to a bait, but it was exellent food for thought.
[/quote]

Nor should it.

Your morality is probably one of the reasons you baited in the first place.

I respect your opinions and if at any stage you ever feel like I'm telling you how to bait (I barely know myself!) then please slap me hard. Very Happy
View user's profileSend private message
SlayerFaith
"Loves her joy stick"


Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5778
Location: Vegas, baby!


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:29 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Foss wrote:
I never really considered the macroeconomic effects of a scam. When they come into money, of course they have to spend it, which is most likely to be in their local communities benefiting their community as a whole.

That's actually microeconomics. The money scammers spend in their local community might very well be beneficial, but the damage they have done to the economy and reputation of scamming "hot spots" like West Africa cannot even be calculated.

_________________
Mugu Reseller Ukraine x2 United Kingdom x24 United States x7 Spain x5 Nigeria x5 Russia x96 South Africa x2 Ivory Coast x2 Netherlands x2 Ghana x2 Australia x2 cameroon x2 Japan x3 Germany Malaysia Canada Benin x3 Malawi France United Arab Emirates United Nations x2 x2 (in a team effort)

ANIMAL,MY FRIEND MY PRAYER IS THIS,LET ALL MY ENEMIES BE IN TROUBLE LIKE CHRIST INGIGE,AND LAZY PEOPLE LIKE YOU BE LIKE WABARA.THANK YOU- Kelechukwu Nduka
"Did he say they have an inflatable pig? That's sick!"- Crash, Vegas 06
"You can be a right Bitch sometimes SF"- Cherrie, GenChat 07

Naked Mod pics!
star
View user's profileSend private message
breadcrumb
Licking Dirty Floors


Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 2075
Location: On my knees, licking floors together with TSnerd


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:38 am Reply with quoteBack to top

^^^^ I dont know much about economics, but thinking of it on a global scale it doesnt look too good again: Cause what do the scammers mainly buy? Cars, cell phones and other luxury goods. And where do they come from? Of course from the US, europe and so on. So the money doesnt really stay in Nigeria in the end.
Not to think of the damage they cause to their country because the honest businessmen have problems because of their countrys reputation. Sad

_________________
I´d vote for Don or TS but Lotta, Juan and sheboppe are the best! But the squirrel still sucks on the buttons *g*

"your papa, i do you ok, you do fuck your self off goodday" Hitman lad to Usm4an B3ll0
"fuck you and your mumu family for ever andv ever, you go die for bicycle accident this year" Hitman to Usm4n B3ll0
"once again thank you for the disappointment and arranged confussion." Barrister Ise
"Do you said am stupid" lad posing as Mike Pence
Click here to support 419Eater.com
Postcount doesn´t matter.
pony Rolling Eyes (Admin Certified)
9x United Kingdom 2x Spain Benin Netherlands Nigeria Switzerland
Mortar x12
View user's profileSend private message
Foss
Master Baiter


Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 170
Location: Somewhere, over the rainbow, way up high


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:58 am Reply with quoteBack to top

SlayerFaith wrote:
Foss wrote:
I never really considered the macroeconomic effects of a scam. When they come into money, of course they have to spend it, which is most likely to be in their local communities benefiting their community as a whole.

That's actually microeconomics. The money scammers spend in their local community might very well be beneficial, but the damage they have done to the economy and reputation of scamming "hot spots" like West Africa cannot even be calculated.


Ummm.... are you sure? I was under the impression that macroeconomics related to the performance of an economy as a whole whereas micro economics tends to relate with demand and supply of goods and services (the price impacts etc) and is more on how indiviuals make decisions. Though, it has been about 8 years since I studied economics in any proper detail.

I would have thought that the scammers money would represent the impacts on growth, inflation etc in the Nigerian economy. Though on a micro economic scale, the increase in money would mean that people are more willing to pay more for a limited resource, thus fueling inflation (macro effect). So I guess it is really a bit of both.
View user's profileSend private message
SlayerFaith
"Loves her joy stick"


Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5778
Location: Vegas, baby!


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:21 am Reply with quoteBack to top

^^^
You've just proved my point. The effects of individual scammers are microeconomic, but the cumulative effect of scamming is macroeconomic.

_________________
Mugu Reseller Ukraine x2 United Kingdom x24 United States x7 Spain x5 Nigeria x5 Russia x96 South Africa x2 Ivory Coast x2 Netherlands x2 Ghana x2 Australia x2 cameroon x2 Japan x3 Germany Malaysia Canada Benin x3 Malawi France United Arab Emirates United Nations x2 x2 (in a team effort)

ANIMAL,MY FRIEND MY PRAYER IS THIS,LET ALL MY ENEMIES BE IN TROUBLE LIKE CHRIST INGIGE,AND LAZY PEOPLE LIKE YOU BE LIKE WABARA.THANK YOU- Kelechukwu Nduka
"Did he say they have an inflatable pig? That's sick!"- Crash, Vegas 06
"You can be a right Bitch sometimes SF"- Cherrie, GenChat 07

Naked Mod pics!
star
View user's profileSend private message
Foss
Master Baiter


Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 170
Location: Somewhere, over the rainbow, way up high


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:40 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Okay, I'll give you that. I was looking at it from an influx of money into an economy approach as opposed to the allocation of resources approach. It all depends on your definition of an economy, which could be a town, a region, a country.
View user's profileSend private message
Gantz
419Eater is my life


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Sitting on the most uncomfortable chair it has ever been my misfortune to own. It numbs my bum :(


PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:12 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Please stop you two, you're hurting my brain.

_________________
Darling i really don'y like spaeking about sex orally because it is against my religion,i prefer we praticalized it - The lovely Sandr@
View user's profileSend private message
Display posts from previous:      
Post new topicReply to topic


 Jump to:   



View next topic
View previous topic
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



** Find out information about your IP address **


All Content © 2003 - 419Eater.com
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group :S5: FI Theme :: All times are GMT