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 Are we really making a dent in lads' wallet?

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Man of many names
Master Baiter


Joined: 24 Oct 2011
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Location: Up north


PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:48 am Reply with quoteBack to top

After baiting for some years, I've been starting to wonder just how much baiting actually hurts the lads. Atleast it doesn't seem to deter them too much, seeing several new 419 messages in my catcher account every day. I've noted some baiters have actually made the lads do things that cost them real money, but in general, are we making a difference?
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chinaspecial
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Joined: 18 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:08 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Even if we don't get them to spend money, we take there time. Have you ever tried writing a email in a foreign language? It's a difficult task even if they make as many errors in Grammar, Spelling and Syntax and above all it take's time and some (minor) expense in the form of time at a Cyber Cafe. So we make a dent in the amount of time they can spend targeting and scamming victims, because as the saying goes - "Time is money" and to lad's who hate spending money even on the essentials of the trade this would piss them of to the extreme and constitute a expense.
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Bankster
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

^^ Also, every minute a lad spends with a baiter is a minute he doesn't spend with a real victim. It's not unusual for a lad to drop real victims at an early stage of his scam in order to focus on what looks like a very promising victim, but in reality is a baiter. So, yes, every little bit helps.

Then there are the (sadly rather rare) baits where lads actually have their lives ruined by skilled baiters. Remember that lads are one of the very few groups of people you can totally fsck up any way you like and feel good about it. Smile

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Dr Mike
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:39 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Most things we waste for them is time and some small amount of internet cafe money.

But as Bankster said we can make bigger dents. Lads on safari for example spend large amounts of time and money. Sadly very few lads opt to go on a safari but those that do often spend hundreds of dollars. Just see The Monsignors ongoing bait. Or mine, Subs and The Danes where lads travel and suffer financially. Even if they choose the cheap option (driving instead of taking a plane and sleeping on a park bench instead of a decent hotel) it cost them money.

So the answer to your question is yes. You make a dent every time you answer a lad without any intention of paying him money. And sometimes if you are good and/or lucky you make a large dent.

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Man of many names
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

chinaspecial wrote:
Have you ever tried writing a email in a foreign language?

Yes, happens every time someone writes me in english Smile
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Morgain Le Fay
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:47 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

If we are wasting their time, then it is working.

If you are going to walk one mile, it looks overwhelming to think of each step you would be taking.

However, when you put one foot in front of the other you will get to the desired end of the mile.

While we may not put them out of business because there will always be new lads to take others places, but by putting one foot in front of the other we are accomplishing putting the hurt on them.

When I first started working I could never imagine getting to retirement age; however a friend of mine told me, just take one day at a time and you will ultimately reach your goal. That I should not think of it was I will retire in <year>,

Collectively, we baiters are putting one foot in front of the other and are making a difference. It might not be a BIG difference, nevertheless it does impact these lads.

That coupled with educating others about these scams makes a difference too.

<now back to the morning coffee!>

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:53 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
Are we really making a dent in lads' wallet?


Just ask Hect0r Laughing Laughing

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windypops
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:03 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

It's not as expensive as it used to be for lads to get online and send out scam email. Like everything else the costs are coming down, and so it's not really a matter of hitting them in the pocket any more.

I see baiting these days as being about spreading paranoia and confusion among lads, to the point where they don't know who or what to believe any more.

On the other hand. If times are bad here, they a lot lot worse there which will drive more desperate people into the cyber cafes. It's a gamble on how they spend their limited resources.

The greedy one's usually have cushy government jobs, and scam as a sideline to buy the extra treats and baubles they need to be somebody in those circles.

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Agent1002
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:26 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

It may be cheap to send out a bunch of email. The expense is in the amount of time it takes to sift through the many bad replies. Without baiters, most replies unfortunately would be rich pickings. Baiters add a ton of rubbish to their inbox much the same way they fill ours. The problem is we seldom work off a script (highly not recommended) so their spam filter can't weed out the bait replies.

I often include the requested personal details in my replies when requested. This results in many phone calls to my free SIP phone attached to an answering machine. Cell phone calls unlike mass mail are not free and are not sent in bulk. It takes the loving personal time for them to place the call. Many lads keep trying to catch me on the phone instead of leaving a message. Many calls is lots of time to make that personal touch.

The stranded lads at the airport with my diplomatic shipment get a call from me (timed about 12 hours offset from when they call) so I leave each of my Jagic Jack lads a voicemail. Short and sweet, this results in them again trying to get me on the phone. Often this results in calls from a sell phone as the lag times to West Africa do not support a good connection over VOIP. When I get a MJ lad on a MJ phone, it results in about 2/3ds of the conversation lost to bandwidth issues and results in a series of call backs by cell phone. LOL.. The lad in New York calling from a 233 area code. Makes my day. Never let the lad know you saw the caller ID.

Conversions asking where he is get them excited and ready to tell you they are at the airport. I wait for them to ask if I sent the money. I ask what money. What is it for, etc. I remember their minutes are costing $ and smile.

Options to tie them up on the phone is to fax the receipt to the concierge. They charge $3 to receive the one page fax. Pick up the white courtesy phone to arrange to pick up the fax. Hang up to send the fax. They will call you back to correct your error.

Another call.. $$$ Very Happy

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:51 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Apart from wasting their time, baiting can include getting fake websites shut down, bank accounts and stolen cc details reported.
And there are always victims and potential victims to help and advise at Scamwarners.
We do make a difference.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:08 am Reply with quoteBack to top

When I pose as an eager victim with a lad's phone number and ASEM my "let's proceed" script into ladland, they quickly force the lad to turn his phone off. That encourages them to call all the more and they keep leaving messages. I have gotten a lot of nice complaints about the cost of repeated calls.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:29 am Reply with quoteBack to top

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vonpaso xlura
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:53 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I'm in the chem bait and another bait where two of us happen to be baiting the same lad. As far as I can tell, both those lads have no real victims, just baiters.

Killing bank accounts may not affect the victims who send money via WU/MG, but killing a website while a victim is being scammed is going to make him suspicious at least, and possibly make it impossible to continue the scam, if he was looking at his fake bank account.

Also it's important to bait the lads who send scripts in French or Spanish. Many of them use machine translation, which a native speaker victim would immediately notice (see my sig) and not answer. If these lads get answers, they'll continue to send scripts, hoping that someone who speaks that language has money.

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ChoppaOfDolla
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 5:00 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I don't think baiting will ever stop the scammers completely, but we can still do a bit of damage in our own way.

Shutting down accounts will hinder some scams, and remember that scammers often use the same bank account for multiple victims. No doubt some victims have been saved as a result of this.

Also, baiters represent, to the lads, a whole flood of useless victims, which wastes their time and make the whole thing seem a lot less worthwhile to them. And many lads get very, very upset when they deal with us, which is always good.

The occasional lad will also be sent on Safari, and a rare few are even arrested.

So yes, we do hurt them at least a bit, which is good. A lot of us are also just in it for the fun, which is fair enough, given that it does at least inconvenience them a lot.

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u got 12 hours to send the money remember no game u fuck face

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 7:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Just time?? NEWBIES!

No we will not ever completely stop them. We can do things to cost them mentally.

I have started with mugus first they try just straight W/U this leads only to aggravation.

Then a new script same mugu, and this time he has banks, I caused six of them to die. I think a fellow baiter caused even more of them to die.

Another script this time real bank accounts darn it they started closing down.

I am pretty sure the photo of "me" did something to him mentally. The photo was of a pre op tranny, full frontal shot naked. This was the start of the melt down

I have a STRONG feeling this guy was really bragging to his friends and everyone.

It was around this time the guy started sending really irrational emails. Not angry he was still fully invested getting money from me. They were sort of pidgin, English, and a few words that came from somewhere in Africa. Once you translated it was just babbling about different things. He tried to send a few emails, but continued he melt down offline I guess.

He was completely invested, time, money, his pride, everything. Well hooked mugus are Amazing.

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psychicbait
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 9:01 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Interesting takes on the subject of real as opposed to perceived lad pain!
One thing about bank accounts.
We don't kill them. We report them.
The bank investigates our claim (via our report) the account is being used for a criminal purpose. They may or may not close the account. Or simply moniter it.
We never really know what the precise result is of reporting an account, but at the very least a closed or reported account gets an average lad into a lot of trouble with his oga/family member who'd facilitated the account. Twisted Evil
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Entomologist
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 9:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi All,

The one important issue that everyone has so far missed is the mind-set of the people in ladland. Scammers are often seen as heroes. Also the attitude of scammers toward each other is not to chop your broda's dolla.

Baiting, I believe is unravelling this trust that scammers have in each other.
The number of times that Gomer hits them must be doing a lot of damage to the inherent trust.
Scammers hopefully will not trust each other eventually and the scene of where they tutor each other will crumble.

That day is a long way off but there are signs of it happening.
Currently the bois go into their cafes and sit alongside each other. They have to trust the guy next to them. If and when that trust dies then their actuvities become restricted. So besides consuming their resources baiting is damaging the whole "broda-hood" unification.

Cheers

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:33 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Captain Pugwash wrote:
I see baiting these days as being about spreading paranoia and confusion among lads, to the point where they don't know who or what to believe any more.

To elaborate on this point... I like to think a well-baited lad will forever be suspicious of any potential victim that asks questions or misunderstands the process. No doubt some real vics have been dropped before the lad ever gets to requesting payment.

And don't underestimate the value of wasting the lads time. I have had lots of lads write me very irritated emails on this very issue. Time is money and lost time is lost money. Obviously, the lads appreciate this fact or they wouldn't write me pissed off emails telling me to stop wasting their time.

No, the world will never be rid of scammers, just like we will never be rid of war, disease, death, and taxes (among others). It is a noble pursuit nonetheless. And way more fun... Very Happy

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:03 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You can't save the whole world and you can't bait all the lads.
There are ways to hurt the lad.. Thinking that because he writes you, he can't write other victims would be crazy, but if you send your lad on 2 weeks safari (like The Monsignor did) that gives all lad's potential victims 2 weeks to realize they've been scammed.

You can also post the scammer email and messages at scamwarners.com and it will be googlable and provide even more evidence for victims.
Hurting lads is not just baiting and silly pictures. It's making the lad doubting every victim and making their lives as unpleasant as possible. Wink

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Benjamin_Franklin
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Great thread. I enjoy reading the thoughts of others on this subject.

One other thing to think about...

I know that slow baiting (one email a day for example) is encouraged. But if you happen to be in touch with a lad with whom you can trade several, if not many emails per day, I see that is better than going slow. That's more time in each day that you are distracting him from his other victims. I know that if I take my time writing a long-ish email to a lad, it might take me at least fifteen minutes while I make sure all the details are in order and line up with the character I am playing. If a lad takes anywhere near that long, let's just say 10 minutes at a time to write back, and you can get him to send six emails a day, that's an hour he's wasted. The drawback is keeping him that busy every day for weeks, but when things wind down you just contact him from another account and resume.

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Mortal
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:54 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

^^^ But this lets lad advance his script quickly and you get to payday in 2 days instead of 2 weeks, you can't build trust in two days so when troubles appear the lad will more likely drop you.
If you really do want to waste his time - save it for later and than let him burn for weeks in different country Very Happy Like PSD's Edward who's been to Singapore Wink Very Happy

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BlueTiger
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:24 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Lads are known to use stolen CC's, so while baiting my not hurt their personal pocket books, as echoed by other posters above, the mental anguish, wasting their time, and keeping busy, not knowing who's a real victim or baiter in their boxes are all WIN's Smile

From a personal experience = an acquaintance of mine was in trouble with impending eviction etc (economy isn't actually good right now). I had never actually used WU or MoneyGram, but went online and tried to send, with nothing but major difficulties. I did end up going in person to a nearby store to do the transfer to keep said ex-friend from becoming homeless. Anyways, my point of sharing this little story - I can only imagine that if I had trouble sending a LEGIT transfer to someone I know, had it been a victim trying to send to a lad... I'm sure victims have similar difficulties that I have had. Lad might drop the victim, thinking they(lad) are being toyed around with by yet another baiter. So that would equal success if a lad sketches on a real person having issues sending money... and all thanks to baiters who have abused these idiot lads for years. Very Happy

Ok everyone, give yourself a pat on the back!

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Entomologist
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:53 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi Bluetiger,

Your post delivers another good point. I had never thought of a RL victim having issues trying to pay a scammer.
A lad that has been toyed with several times would certainly be wary that he has another joker.

Making lads paranoid is what I like to aim at. I hadn't thought of the above.
All the failed WU and MG payments do serve more pain than I initially thought.

Most baits I have skipped over the WU routines and headed for the bank accs. I may change that style now.
The side-catch of baiting lads is that I try to make them suspicious of their Brodas. Undermining fellow scammers' trust in each other will cause confusion and restrict their activities.

Cheers

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BearSeason
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:00 am Reply with quoteBack to top

It can be hard to maintain a positive attitude when baiting, especially when you hear stories about victims being taken for thousands. It's discouraging to hear. But imagine how bad things would be if we didn't bait.

That comes from my husband, by the way. He doesn't bait himself because he has the tech savvy of a six-year-old but he wanted to me to pass along his words of encouragement to the community. He cheers us from the side-lines!

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

“Also the attitude of scammers toward each other is not to chop your broda's dolla.”

If I could amend this concept, if you define broda as a member of your gang, I would agree to an extent.

But I feel it would be more fitting to say "don’t get caught chopping a fellow Nigerian dolla." Its amazing how cut throat these guys can be.

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you realy made me a fool which i dont expected from you" mr malambo

"Any money you send to Africa to receive your payment is at your own risk " David Mark


over 1,000 fakes deaded since Oct 2005. This is my current rampage! Mortar x6 Easter Egg 2011 Purple Flower
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