Bombs over Sonoma

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Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:00 pm

A couple of years ago I had the privilege of flying in a restored B-17 'Flying Fortress' bomber over San Francisco bay. Late yesterday I enjoyed another 'warbird' experience by going up in a B-24 'Liberator' over the vineyards of Sonoma. It was really amazing!

The B-17 is the best-known WWII aircraft, popular among aviators and journalists during the war and still popular among history buffs today. But while the B-24 is not as sexy it was more important to the war effort with a longer range, faster speed, and heavier payload. Over 18,000 were built, the largest production of military aircraft in history. Yet out of those 18,000 planes there are only two still flying today.

Pilots during the war loved the B-17 for its maneuverability and legendary ruggedness. The B-24 was considerably less popular. It was nicknamed 'Flying Boxcar' by those who felt charitable but most called it the 'Flying Coffin.' It's a cramped, uncomfortable plane with extremely difficult access, making it very hard to escape from in an emergency. It is also notoriously difficult to fly, requiring almost superhuman strength to manage the controls. How those young wartime pilots kept these hulking beasts in tight formation during 8-10 hour missions is a mystery to me. Compared to the relatively smooth flight of the B-17, my ride in the B-24 bordered on terrifying. A lurching, bumpy flight that felt like a Mack truck on a dirt road. It was also impossibly noisy and windy. The waist gunners' windows are wide open -- not covered with plexiglass as in a B-17. I expected a lot of wind to come rushing into the tail of the plane as a result, but that was nothing compared to all the wind coming through other gaps in the fusilage. Despite flying at low altitude on a beautiful spring afternoon it was damn cold up there. But that was nothing like the minus-40 degrees F temperatures crews endured at 20,000 feet during the war. Imagine being suited up in a heavy, heated outfit and wearing an oxygen mask for a 10-hour mission, with frigid wind coursing throughout the plane -- and of course the constant threat of flak or enemy fighters. It really gives you pause when you think about what these young men went through.

For me it was an exhilirating adventure but despite the lack of enemy attacks I certainly didn't feel safe, especially when standing by the open waist gunner's position as the plane banked for turns. Shocked

But it was a fabulous experience and I recommend it to anyone who can hook up with the many tours around the US organized by the Collings Foundation. Here are a few pictures.

Preparing for takeoff:

Seating for takeoff and landing was cramped and extremely uncomfortable. These guys are sitting on the floor. I was belted in on a very narrow bench over the door to the bomb bay, right over the ball turret.

It wasn't any less cramped once we were in the air and could move around:

But the view was stunning:

Banking for a sharp turn to head back to the airport:

Looking straight down through the open waist gunner's window as we banked. I wasn't strapped in so I was hanging on hoping not to drop my camera, or fall out myself:

The tail gunner's position is extremely cramped, very windy, but offers a great view. Fortunately I didn't see any fighter planes coming after us:

If nature calls during a long mission there is a toilet. But no privacy, and on a mission crewmembers would have to get out of bulky flight suits and put up with sub-zero temperatures to sit on the aptly-named can. The wax-paper bag in the canister would then be jettisoned out the waist gunner's window, hopefully not over a friendly city.

Edit: spelling

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:39 pm

There is an annual airshow in Frederick,Md which is just west of me.6 or 7 years ago,I went for a ride with my girlfriend and her daughter who live out that way.She told me to drive out to the airport,as there was an old warplane out there that she thought I might like to see.It was this same aircraft,painted up as the famous "Dragon and his Tail"I have to say I was speechless.From what I have read there are 3 still in flyable condition,and here I was standing next to one.As we were standing there,an aircraft was coming in for a landing.She asked me what it was.My eyes aren't the best in the world.At first all I saw was a big olive drab shape with 4 prop engines on it.C130 I figured.As it got closer,I saw it wasn't a C130.It had a glazed nose and the shape was all wrong.Then damn if a B17 didn't touch down on the runway.Such a lumbering beast,yet so graceful.I damn near started crying.It was owned by the same outfit that owned the B24,and they were flying parts in for one of the engines.Glad you got to take I ride.Myself,I was dumbfounded standing so close to aircraft I had read about and seen in newsreels so much.Never thoughtI would see one up close,much less watch one land.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:06 am

Exciting, isn't it? Very Happy

There are 3 airworthy B-24s but only 2 actually flying. The other operating plane is in Texas, part of the Commemorative Air Force. The third is at Fantasy of Flight outside of Orlando but is not currently being flown.

The Collings Foundation was also flying their B-17 yesterday, the "Nine-O-Nine":

These are fabulous planes and it's a thrill to fly on them but there are inherent risks. From the Collings Foundation website:

Quote:

In August 1987, while performing at an airshow in western Pennsylvania, "Nine-O-Nine" was caught by a severe crosswind moments after touchdown. The right wing lifted in the air, finally coming down too far down the runway. Despite the efforts of her crew, she rolled off the end of the runway, crashed through a chain link fence, sheared off a power pole and roared down a 100-foot ravine to a thundering stop. The landing gear sheared off, the chin turret was smashed and pushed into the nose; the Plexiglas nose was shattered; bomb bay doors, fuselage, fuselage, ball turret, wing and nacelles all took a tremendous beating. Engines and propellers were also torn form their mounts. Fortunately, there were no fatalities to the crew or riders although there were injuries.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:17 am

That is the B17 I saw Flying parts in for the B24.A lumbering,graceful,magnificent creature.Flying in one is risky sure,but to live a moment of that history is worth it.
THe B24 was a superior bomber,but damn isn't a B17 one good looking machine?
I read once that the fuel system in a B24 was prone to leaks,so the pilots would normally fly with the bomb bay doors slightly open to vent the fumes.Maybe thats part of the source of the draft

Baiting Guru Joined: 31 Jan 2007 Posts: 12237

Very cool! I was a WWII aircraft buff as a kid, I made many models. I think my favorite was the P-38.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:29 am

Between the two I much preferred flying in the B-17. This is the Liberty Belle, which I flew in:

And the highlight of that flight:

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:35 am

A tough aircraft to be certain.Here is a link to a site that shows just how much damage these things could take and come back.Some it is beyond belief. http://www.daveswarbirds.com/b-17/contents.htm

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:43 am

Wow - stunning pictures Juan. I've never seen the Golden Gate from that angle Very Happy

Baiting Guru Joined: 29 Jan 2008 Posts: 2531 Location: AU

very nice. I would love to have a spitfire. You can buy replicas for about $45,000au

friend of mine has been doing up and finished a 1944 willies jeep
canadian WII supply/troop carrier truck used in Queensland.
WWII Motorcycle (not sure what type)

they look awesome and can be driven on the roads.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 4:14 am

That is awesome Juan and thanks for sharing. Wink

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:29 am

At Duxford near us they have the only B17 Sally B flying in the Uk, they have to rely on donations from the public to keep it flying.

Duxford is some airfield, there is a Americian museum and a list of the 30,000 airmen who lost their lives, during the 2nd world war as well as other wars, since.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:25 am

Great shots, Juan. Quite an experience flying in one of these I'm sure.

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 3:45 pm

Great shots. I worked for 15 years with a flight engineer/ waist gunner on a B-17. What an amazing character. A long time ago he saw me with a video camera and asked me if I knew what a fluffer was on a shoot. He was just testing me. Another time, he came back from jury duty and told me he strung the judge along like I always do. When asked if anyone had ever been shot at, he told them he had been thousands of times. The judge then asked him how that was. He replied that he was dropping bombs on them. The judge told him he would have been shooting at him too. He told me about the time the other waist gunner pulled his oxygen plug during a mission and redding out while shooting his machine gun. He showed me his "short snorter", a dollar bill signed by the crew that he rolled up to snort chopped up Benzedrine prescribed by the flight surgeon. He said that after snorting up on the flight line and having his mission scrubbed due to clouds over the primary and secondary targets he cleaned every bicycle in the squadron. He said he never did Bennies until he saw the English Channel after that. His crew volunteered to be "flight lead" as soon as they got to England. They would drop markers over the target so that the following bombers would have an aim point. For that, they could go home after 20 missions instead of 25. They thought it was a good idea until they found out that the Germans were very smart and would attack the lead bomber head on. No lead bomber crew prior to theirs made their 20 missions.

I worked for 12 years with a B-24 pilot and always wondered about him. I would look down at something for just a moment while he was driving and we would end up lost. I asked him how the heck he ever flew a B-24 and he said he had a navigator. An amazing statistic I came across this week is that B-24 crews had a lower survival rate than Japanese Kamikazes.
Edit-typo

Baiting Guru Joined: 19 Apr 2007 Posts: 3123

I can only say that I despise all old aircraft Laughing

If it's older than 20 years, or doesn't have a glass cockpit, I ain't interested Razz

Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:41 am

I found this great youtube video tonight, showing the same B-24 in the air -- dropping bombs (duds) and firing machine guns (blanks). When I flew on it I didn't even realize the guns were fully operable. An amazing airplane. I commend the Collings Foundation for keeping this great piece of history in operating condition and taking it all around the country to make it available as living history.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ueUJPqWWbY